Comment by Armok_the_bunny@lemmy.world on Intel was once a Silicon Valley leader. How did it fall so far?

The marketing and advertising and sales teams took over management from the engineering team, and decided to cut all the corners. It’s a classic tale at this point, same thing happened to Boeing and Apple and Google and etc. It’s why everything sucks nowadays.

There might be things that Apple is stagnating on, but silicon and ARM CPU transitions definitely ain’t one of those things. The rest of the industry is scrambling to catch up with them asap.

Just ask Apple, they’ll tell you so.

Don’t trust any silicon manufacturer’s marketing department. Let the processing and battery life benchmarks and real world tests do the talking.

AMD’s CPUs are faster and more power efficient on the same process node. (i.e. 5nm vs 5nm)

https://www.cpu-monkey.com/en/compare_cpu-amd_ryzen_ai_9_hx_370-vs-apple_m2

Apple just has a big budget to buy out TSMC process nodes a generation early, their designs and architectures aren’t actually faster or more power efficient than AMD’s x86 cpus.

https://www.macrumors.com/2023/02/22/apple-secures-tsmc-3nm-chips/

Am I blind? I don’t see any information in there to draw any conclusions about power efficiency. The little information that I do see actually seems to imply the apple silicon chip would be more efficient. Help me out please?

Both chips are 20w class cpus, but the AMD cpu is much faster.

Apple CPUs don’t report wattage, so it’s a bit tricky to measure actual power consumption, but I can’t imagine the AMD cpu uses 50% more power under load.

The Apple CPU might score some wins for idle power consumption though, considering the optimizations in MacOS, and the focus on power consumption across the whole system design.

24 threads at 2.00 GHz vs. 8 threads at 0.66 GHz with a 40% difference in TDP. The AMD chip may draw more power, but has much higher performance. Simplifying things, it can perform 9x the operations as the Apple silicon for only 1.4x the power draw.

Iirc the die area for Apple’s chips are also a lot larger and that’s expensive. It’s a lot easier for them to tank that cost because they are building them for themselves rather than selling them to vendors who manufacture products like AMD.

Yeah, Apple’s vertical integration and volume is enviable.

Minor nit, but I believe that AMD CPU is 4nm

I believe both M2 and Zen 5 use 4nm. 4nm is just a slightly improved 5nm, though. It’s the same process node, not an entirely new process node like 3nm.

But then Apple would have to drop it’s prices by 40% so people would keep buying.

But that would make it accessible to commoners! *gasp*

These new snapdragon based windows laptops have to be a serious wake up call for intel. General personal computing is quickly moving away from x86 and the latest “efficiency” core processors from intel can’t compete.

For those that don’t follow the industry at all, is there somewhere that has a good write up on what’s been going on?

And? Linux was on ARM since about beginning.

What relevance does Linux have in this specific context? Does Linux have a marketing team? Does Linux compete on a hardware level with Apple? Is there a Linux corp we haven’t heard about that’s working with some chip manufacturer we also haven’t heard about in order to create ARM processors that can compete with Apple silicon? No? Maybe don’t shoehorn Linux into everything regardless of relevance, especially not in such a lane way.

Because compared to other OSes Apple just catches up.

Does Linux have a marketing team?

No marketing team = no enshittification by marketing

Is there a Linux corp we haven’t heard about that’s working with some chip manufacturer we also haven’t heard about in order to create ARM processors that can compete with Apple silicon?

So you agree that transitioning to ARM isn’t impressive. Now it’s time to show you that making processors isn’t something only oh-so-great Yoppl can do. Linux Foundation has its own chip designing subsidiary - CHIPS Alliance. They designed stuff like vector coprocessor, RISC-V core(and older VeeR cores), maintains Chisel HDL and many smaller projects. And I only named what only Linux Foundation does, community and other organizations(including chinese T-head) do even more.

Great, now show me the Linux ARM laptop that’s competing with MacBooks at the consumer level. You do have something that’s actively turning people away from Apple Silicon, yes?

How is competeing with macbooks at the consumer level is related to enshittification by marketing team becoming managment?

Now me Apple ARM laptop that’s competeing with chromebooks.

It’s not just the big tech, some startups are the same because they’re vying for VC cash and that’s the best way to do it

Vulture Capital will collapse capitalism.

Microsoft is on the same path, yay!

Better them than accountants and lawyers.

I was including the accountants and lawyers in that list, just to be clear. They’re all bad if they don’t have any idea how the technical side of their business functions.

I think they are different levels of bad. To paraphrase the old adage, If sales takes over your company, be wary. If accountants take over, start looking for a new job. If lawyers take over quit.

I can see how accountants and sales can be bad, but how exactly do lawyers fuck up? Not saying they don’t, just asking how it plays out.

They only bring in the lawyers when something is truly fucked, like the Board taking control from administration. They usually take over when the time has come to investigate fraud, dismantle or otherwise heavily restructure the company.

Oh but then the lawyers are like white blood cells? They are good? Lawyers are friends? (Unless you’re a black hat/criminal I guess)

I mean, and I’m thinking more in the context of retirement investments here, the moment any of those things happen I’m inclined to jump ship. I am thoroughly unaware of any time such a move has turned out well in the long run. Same sentiment for stock buybacks, though that one because if that’s the best thing the company can think of to spend money on they are completely out of good ideas.

If you’re talking about the lastest gen desktop CPUs, they just clocked them too high.

This has been an ongoing problem ever since, like, Ivy Bridge/the 3000 series… and yes, probably has to do with management and marketing decisions tbh, so they can be 2% ahead of AMD in some stupid benchmark. AMD is guilty of this too, and you can see what “sanely” clocked chips look like with their X3D series.

That is absolutely not the only issue. They had oxidation issues in two successive generations of consumer CPUs, likely knew about it, and sold them anyways. They’re trying to get out of reimbursing, replacing, or compensating anyone for the fucked cores, and as a direct result, a massive class-action suit is starting to roll.

They’re trying to get out of reimbursing, replacing, or compensating anyone for the fucked cores, and as a direct result, a massive class-action suit is starting to roll.

Well, the big boys have gotten out of their responsibility for all such things in many-many seemingly unconnected areas in the last ~15 years. What do you want, it had to reach Intel.

Still the fact that this enshittification has accelerated to the extent that people notice it is just amazing. Civilization cracking all over on our eyes.

My point was that had proper engineers been in charge instead, they would have noticed and listened to the people on the ground that I am certain knew about the problem, and it would have been fixed before any consumers got their hands on the product.

This is a most excellent place for technology news and articles.

Our Rules

Follow the lemmy.world rules.
Only tech related content.
Be excellent to each another!
Mod approved content bots can post up to 10 articles per day.
Threads asking for personal tech support may be deleted.
Politics threads may be removed.
No memes allowed as posts, OK to post as comments.
Only approved bots from the list below, to ask if your bot can be added please contact us.
Check for duplicates before posting, duplicates may be removed

Intel was once a Silicon Valley leader. How did it fall so far?(www.vox.com)

Technology

!technology@lemmy.world

Our Rules

Approved Bots

Community stats

Community moderators