32 points
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Conclusion of the article sums it up best:

“Our true responsibility is to use our choices as political agents in the world to try to shift power, take power away from the people who are blocking the transition away from fossil fuels and give it to people who will lead into a livable future,” [Genevieve Guenther, the author of “The Language of Climate Politics”] said.

Do what you can by yourself, sure, but only as a supplement to doing the hard work to solve the problem via collective and political action.

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16 points

I agree.
But the corporations and companies that have done most of the polluting need to clean their messes up if there’s going to be any change.

You, nor my neighbor, nor any of our friends dumped so much crap into nearby rivers and lakes that everything is poisoned. The corporations and companies did it.

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6 points

100%

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7 points
*

If the one thing is redacted a billionaire, you would only need 3200 people.

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60 points

In 2005, fossil fuel company BP hired the large advertising campaign Ogilvy to popularize the idea of a carbon footprint for individuals.

BP oil company pushed the idea that our individual carbon footprints matter so that everyone can share the blame of what the fossil fuel industry has done.

Don’t fall for it. Only corporations pollute enough to matter. Only corporations can provide alternatives to fossil fuels. Only corporations can make a meaningful reduction to greenhouse gas emissions.

The most significant difference individuals can make is to create political and legal pressure by voting and protesting.

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2 points

Those are important, but the act of doing things like installing solar panels, or a heat pump changes minds — and when you do it, others around you see and imitate.

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3 points

I’d rather put my money into feeding the hungry than consumption effecting nothing but my ego.

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0 points

I can’t control your spending, but it’s a really effective outreach tool.

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1 point

I can’t afford those things just like most of the people impacted by climate change. But maybe that’s the point of redirecting the focus to those actions.

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10 points

BP oil company pushed the idea that our individual carbon footprints matter so that everyone can share the blame of what the fossil fuel industry has done.

The article discusses this, yes - along with how the carbon footprint is a good metric for individual consumption even if corporate propaganda abuses it.

The most significant difference individuals can make is to create political and legal pressure by voting and protesting.

I agree with you that political action is vital. I don’t agree that it’s necessarily more significant than personal action. Feminists used to say “the personal is political”, and it’s still true. How you act in private demonstrates your commitment to the values you endorse in public and gives your voice more weight when you speak your values.

If you reduce your personal footprint, but never talk about it or encourage other people to do the same, your impact is limited to yourself. If you reduce your personal footprint, and make your actions contagious by talking about them with people you know and encouraging them to do the same, you can impact many more people, encourage them to follow your lead and reduce their footprint, and then they can encourage others to reduce their footprint, and so on and so forth.

Limiting the damage from climate change takes collective action. And collective action requires a community, and a community requires communication.

If you assume you are a lone individual and your personal decisions have no effect on anyone else, it’s easy to imagine reducing your personal footprint is meaningless. If you see yourself as part of a community, and by reducing your personal footprint you encourage others in your community to do the same, you can see how much larger your impact can be.

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2 points

So you’re repeating the BP talking points.

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7 points

Again, carbon footprint is not a BP talking point. It was a pre-existing concept that was appropriated by BP to prevent climate change legislation by shifting responsibility for climate change to individual consumers.

And then, some years later, once corporations had more solid control of legislatures and were no longer afraid of legislation, they started using the carbon footprint idea in reverse as propaganda - they claimed individual responsibility was a myth, only legal action against corporations will help with climate change, so eat whatever you want and buy all the gas you want and buy all the corporate products you want, and don’t feel guilty about it, because it doesn’t matter.

In reality, both individuals and corporations bear responsibility for climate change, and both of the above arguments are corporate propaganda aimed at getting you to give up, do nothing, and buy shit.

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1 point
Deleted by creator
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2 points

Think of it like this - companies are contaminating everything with lead, because it’s slightly cheaper for them

People get concerned for good reason

So some companies pay to make lead free products and sell them at a premium. They put it all over the packaging

Other companies see this, and start putting it on their packaging, despite still having an unsafe lead content

All of them do media campaigns and lobby the government, further confusing the issue

People need to buy food, and are working with limited information. They don’t have the time to educate themselves over every purchase - you’d need experts dedicated to testing and compiling the data

So, for the good of everyone (the companies included) we made that. You can go to the grocery store and buy food, confident it doesn’t contain large amounts of lead.

People definitely care, but systematic problems can only be solved systematically

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1 point

The fossil fuel industry has spent a lot of money making us dependent on them. They have been so successful that the majority of us would not be able to survive without their products whether it be to get to work, power our cities, heat our buildings, etc.

So what’s a realistic approach to the problem:

Getting billions of individuals to change across the planet? Which requires most of them and their families to die?

Or

Changing a few dozen companies?

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1 point

How do you expect to change those few dozen companies?

Especially if the majority of us really wouldn’t be able to survive without them?

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-1 points

So what’s a realistic approach to the problem:

Getting billions of individuals to change across the planet? Which requires most of them and their families to die?

AND

Changing a few dozen companies.

Changes like this don’t happen in an empty space. If you have an Eco aware consumer base it help a lot.

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-1 points

Corps make and sell what we buy.

Arguments like yours seem to condense down to “I won’t change until a corp forces me to” which makes no sense to me.

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2 points

Tell that to the marketing team BP hired to say the same thing you’re saying.

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-1 points
*

Notice this response isn’t “that’s wrong and here’s why” it’s “someone else also said this”.

Even if it were true that I was repeating BP taking points, that’s not a good reason to discount it.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_fallacy

To help drive the point home, how many widgets will a company make if no one is buying them anymore?

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9 points

Not only that, but only collective action and politics can give people the choices they need to reduce climate change.

It’s no use telling people not to drive if there’s no public transport system. And people can’t individually will their energy to have a generation mix.

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6 points

We should all work towards curbing climate change by learning how to build guillotines

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-2 points

That’s mostly a waste of time.

The big companies and massive organizations are the ones really doing the damage. This isn’t really a tragedy of the commons.

But individuals do need to make the changes they can, because if every company and government did the right thing, we still wouldn’t be all the way there. Climate is an impossibly big issue, and need everything and then a little bit more to get out of the mess.

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6 points

Who do those big companies and massive organizations (?!) produce for?

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3 points

Generally consumers, and I agree with your overall sentiment, but other major exchanges of goods and energy include things like military and essential services.

I’m making changes where I can, but I can’t just refuse medical services because my doctor doesn’t use a free-range organic MRI, and me bringing a reusable bag to the grocery store does nothing to reduce the amount of toxic waste the US military lights on fire every year.

I need internet, but there’s only one provider in my area. If my house is on fire or I call an ambulance, I don’t care what kind toxic gases are coming out of the first responder’s tailpipes.

I’ll still continue to fly less, buy less, drive my EV, swap my gas appliances, procure renewable electricity, and use more sustainable products. It’s not going to solve all of the worlds problems, but I do think collective action has the potential to drive a significant amount of the global transition to lower emissions.

The rest is done at the polls.

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3 points

It would be a good rebuttal if there wasn’t all the marketing and ads to consume.

Ad agencies literally study what works and what doesn’t, always refining their techniques, so that they can sell you more shit.

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-1 points

If you’re susceptible to ads then that is also on you.

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1 point

Edward Bernays

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8 points

Stop buying their shit!

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