Rockstar Games’ servers have been under heavy fire from massive DDoS attacks in recent days, causing widespread login and connectivity issues for players of GTA Online. These attacks come in the wake of Rockstar’s recent implementation of BattlEye, a new anti-cheat system designed to crack down on in-game cheating, sparking backlash from a segment of the player base. Protesters, unhappy with the new system, have resorted to using distributed denial-of-service (DDoS) attacks to disrupt the servers, escalating tensions between the gaming giant and its community.

-3 points

So a bunch of assholes who like to ruin everyone else’s fun are mad because they can’t be script kiddie cheaters anymore. So instead they found another way to run everyone else’s fun. Cool.

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-2 points

Unpopular opinion…

Man, I wrote a whole WoT about this. Deleted it. Fuck the cheaters. I don’t know why it’s so hard to stop them. The kind of people that will DDoS a company for blocking them are the same ones that will cheat. No gold star for any honest players that DDoS, either. If there’s a server problem or a bad patch that prevents me from playing my first thought isn’t to DDoS the company and fuck up everyone else’s game in a fit of petty revenge too. That said, it’s sad that honest players are the only ones harmed after the cheat coders found their workaround so quickly.

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36 points

That’s not what this is about, the article is simply garbage. They are enforcing a kernel level anti-cheating system that is incompatible with Linux (where no third party gets kernel access, and rightly so). This locks out all Linux players, including Steam Deck.

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-49 points

Bitchy cheaters throwing a hissy that they can’t keep creating an unfair advantage for themselves in an online environment. I hope their mothers take away their internet connection for the month.

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84 points

Probably a few Linux/Steam Deck players pissed that Rockstar just nuked their ability to play without warning or reason as well.

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37 points

Those are legitimate victims, fuck the cheaters.

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51 points

The cheaters have already found a way to bypass this stupid shit. It only affects legitimate users and cheaters too stupid to figure out the seemingly trivial workaround.

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2 points

I’m upset they nuked Linux support, my PC is Linux and have a steam deck

I’m still not going to fucking ddos them for it

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-8 points

Yeah that’s shitty. I’d rather the cheaters ruin the game for a subsection of the populace rather than all of them though.

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10 points

Battleye is supported on steam deck

But honestly FUCK kernel level ACs

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19 points

Battleye is, but they didn’t enable it for Linux. Literally a switch, and they failed to do so.

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7 points

Heh, I would say the cheaters are generally much more immature and likely to DDOS. I think there is a lot of overlap over video game cheaters and script kiddies, especially when the cheaters are called hackers

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3 points

Qnd cheaters have money (the same they use to buy cheats) to pay for botnets

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16 points
*

Eh, I was playing it on steam deck, GTA online was just not worth it with all the cheating anyway.

What I don’t get is why they went with the most invasive kernel level stuff instead of doing even the most basic server side checks to check for users doing physically impossible stuff.

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5 points

Man, that sounds familiar. I gave up on Escape from Tarkov for the same reason.

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14 points

Because it’s cheaper than actually implementing working anti heat instead of just stealing control of your computer and leaving gaping vulnerabilities on it.

After all, why would they care? It’s not their computer.

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3 points
*

Server-side checks cost processing power and memory hence they need to spend more on servers.

Client side kernel-level anti-cheat only ever consumes resources and cause problems to the actual gamers, not directly to Rockstart’s bottom line (and if it makes the game comms slightly slower on the client side it might even reduce server resource consumption).

If Rockstar’s management theory is that gamers will endure just about any level of shit and keep on giving them money (a posture which, so far, has proven correct for just about every large game maker doing that kind of shit) then they will logically conclude that their bottom line won’t even suffer indirectly from making life harder for their existing clients whilst it will most definitelly suffer if they have more server costs due to implementing server side checks for cheating.

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-18 points

Linux users playing dirty? Not a good look.

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31 points

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BattlEye

Interacts with the game at the kernel level.

Fuck cheaters, but also FUCK kernel level shit, it’s possible to make a good AC without fucking around in the kernel.

I don’t even install third party Antivirus’ that hook into the kernel because of all the issues it causes. 80% of all BSODs I’ve traced back have always had a root cause because of some shit piece of software fucking around in the kernel. 15% is shitty drivers.

Kernel AVs and ACs actually act like malware in of itself with the types of hooks and interactions it performs. Anything operating at the kernel level can basically see just about everything you or your computer is doing

Fuck kernel level AC

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-4 points

it’s possible to make a good AC without fucking around in the kernel.

What if the cheat runs in the kernel? I am also against these extremely invasive anti-cheat measures, but it must be clear to everyone that the cheat developers and users have no qualms about this.

A user level AC can do shit all against that if the cheat runs in ring 0.

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1 point

A) They can actually invest in server-side detection

B) Cheats running at ring0 aren’t invisible, unkillable maybe, but AC just needs to detect to ban/kick user

There’s no excuse for kernel AC, it’s just a cheap, lazy shortcut

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22 points

80% of all BSODs I’ve traced back have always had a root cause because of some shit piece of software fucking around in the kernel

CrowdStrike has entered the chat.

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1 point
*

They’ve been a boom to the cyber security industry though, even though it wasn’t a virus and didn’t really damage anything simply the fact that it happened has forced management to actually appreciate the importance of cyber security, and cyber integrity.

They are hiring like crazy now.

Now if only the United States could be convinced that remote working isn’t the work of the devil, we might be in for a productive few decades in the technology space. No need for AI

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67 points

Don’t buy games with invasive user-side anti-cheats that hamper performance, and demand refunds on any game that adds it after purchase.

I don’t understand why this is so hard for people. If everyone gave a shit, we could end this. But instead, people would rather just complain while still forking over the money to these companies.

There are so many good indie games without this kind of bullshit. We have better choices.

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6 points

It didn’t have “invasive user side anti-cheat” on day one you doughnut

That’s why Linux users bought it. This was added YEARS after release

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1 point

Where did I even remotely imply otherwise?

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3 points

“Don’t buy games with invasive user-side anti-cheats that hamper performance, and demand refunds on any game…”

1st point: AC Wasn’t there at purchase

2nd point: AC was added decades later so how can one return the game?

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5 points

Is “get rid of all anti-cheat” a popular position outside of Lemmy? I don’t really play these sorts of games but was under the impression that most competitive multiplayer would be unplayable without anti-cheat measures.

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13 points
*

There are plenty of anti-cheat measure that doesn’t require invasive access to your system or performance hits. The objection is not to fighting cheating, it is with the specific overreaching methodology chosen to do so.

Also I personally rarely play multiplayer so it’s even more frustrating to have bullshit installed on my system for a feature that doesn’t even apply to me.

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5 points

Anti-cheat measures should be baked into the server side. 99 percent of the multiplayer cheating problem is not adhering to the golden rule of server security: Never Trust the Client

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2 points

It’s not even popular on Lemmy. People are fine with the anti-cheat. They draw the line at enforced third-party accounts, though, which is commendable.

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3 points

It is perfectly possible to run anti-cheat that are roughly as good (or as bad, as it often turns out) without full admin privilege and running as kernel-level drivers. Coupled with server-side validation, which seems to be a dying breed, you’d also weed out a ton of cheaters while missing the most motivated of them.

As someone who lurks around in different communities (to some extent; Steam forums, reddit, lemmy, mastodon, and a few game-centered discord servers), the issue is not much against anti-cheat for online play. It’s the nature of these piece of software that is the issue. It would not be the same if the anti-cheat was also forced on solo gameplay, but it is not the case here.

(bonus points for systems that allow playing on non-protected servers, but that’s asking a bit too much from some publishers I suppose)

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3 points

I legitimately avoided rockstar for years because they force you to use their store even when you buy on steam. I still haven’t played rdr2, despite critical acclaim. I finally caved and got GTAV on sale cause I realised none of this shit works. Consumers using purchasing power to enforce standards is a losing battle. The storefronts or legislators need to enforce this shit. I think it should be valve. They have the market position and userbase to actually succeed or at the very least convince publishers to not break shit that was already working fine.

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1 point
*

Name one war which was ever fought on a single battlefield.

Yes, we should be pushing for both regulatory changes and changes on platforms like Steam, but we should also being doing our part.

If there is anything I’ve learned over time it is that nobody is coming to save you. Ever. If you are holding out for someone to swoop in and make things better, you will be waiting forever. Either we do it ourselves, or it doesn’t get done.

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98 points

They implemented this 10 years after the game’s release. It’s harder to vote with your wallet at that point.

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37 points

and demand refunds on any game that adds it after purchase.

The way I see it, adding it, even this late, is changing the terms of the agreement and thus justification for a refund. Steam will often see it that way too if you word it as such. And if not, hell, you can still badger the publisher for a refund incessantly so at least it still costs them the equivalent in man hours even if you don’t get the refund. The point is not to be passive, even if we don’t get to win every single battle.

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7 points

Companies like Rockstar certainly would meet any requests for refunds outside of very recently purchased with “Go kick rocks.”. For sure they changed the rules/ experience after the fact, but you can bet it’s covered in the small print of the EULA. Even if they received (and denied) 100,000 requests, they would care a bit unless they saw a significant slump in their overall sales. Sadly, a lot of their customers will be pissed about this but will be first in line buying other Rockstar games.

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3 points

Right, I bought that shit in 2014 I think. Haven’t played it in several years.

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11 points

Probably testing it for gta6.

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5 points

And that’s the one we can refuse to buy.

But let’s be honest - people won’t. They’ll buy it in record numbers - just not on Linux.

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145 points

If I played any Rockstar games, I’d be unhappy with their new anti-cheat too, since it needlessly blocks linux, but this isn’t the way this should be protested. If anything, this probably validates their decision.

The way this should be protested is to just stop playing. Stop giving them money. Stop boosting their month active user numbers that they can flaunt to investors. Hit them financially, since it’s the only hit they really care about. There’s a sea of other high-quality games you can play instead.

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83 points

I did this with Blizzard/Activision years ago.

Zero impact.

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15 points

It was an impact of one.

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59 points

Keep it up. There’s dozen(s) of us?

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21 points

There’s dozen(s) of us?

Dozen(s?) Denial Of Service attack

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8 points

I’m pretty sure it’s not Linux gamers doing this.

It’s cheaters.

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7 points

Cheat creators probably, they gotta protect their revenue

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49 points
*

Gamers and still buying the same old tired shit while bitching about it, name a more…

You’re absolutely right. The number of great games to play is absurd and the access to them has never been better but for some reason most people just play mediocre games that should have been put out to pasture years ago.

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-8 points

In your opinion.

Stop gatekeeping people’s game choices. You can play what you want, and they can play what they want.

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7 points

We’re in a thread about Rockstars invasive anti-cheat software so no, people can’t play what they want nor is this the place to tell people not to gatekeep.

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1 point

GTA Online has terrible monetization and Rockstar are openly hostile towards PC as a platform, but I wouldn’t call GTA mediocre at all. There’s nothing quite like the attention to detail or breadth of GTA games. If you’ve played a few GTA clones, you’ll know what the competition looks like and it’s not even close.

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5 points

Idk Cyberpunk makes GTA look like a intern project.

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5 points

Yeah, I’m actually supportive of some kind of anti cheat on GTA online, because with all the cheating it’s just unplayable. Unfortunately I was playing on steam deck so I haven’t been able to play it since. Presumably it can be supported relatively easy so I hope they fix that issue.

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23 points
*

Have you tried not buying something in protest? If so have you noticed they keep selling it anyway and you have no alternative? Not giving them money isn’t enough.

I’m not a fan of DoSA as it’s rather strongarm but at least this actually sends a message to them AND other users.

I’m not interested in having to fight anti-features to play what I paid for, but at least circumventing it sends a message.

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3 points

if so have you noticed they keep selling it anyway and you have no alternative?

You seem to have missed the point. The alternative is not playing the game at all.

Be an adult, have some self-control.

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4 points

As an adult you may notice you spend less time with your friends. So if you’ve tried that you’d know how sad it is when you can’t play games with your friends because of your values. When you care about video games then your interpretation of “the point” leaves a lot to be desired. I aspire for a better gaming industry.

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6 points

I bought Crysis and didn’t like the DRM, so I haven’t bought a Ubisoft game since. How’s that working out for Ubisoft?

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3 points

I think Ubisoft didn’t notice, or very likely attributed others reasons for less sales.

I don’t like DRM so I don’t use streaming services like Netflix. If friends or work colleges keep talking about some show then I read Wikipedia plot section to get an idea 💀

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32 points

I’ve read that Steam is accepting refunds for GTAV - I’d recommend anyone who bought it there refund it.

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12 points

Really??? Even if I bought it years ago lmao? It no longer works on my steam deck, but its not like I bought it when the deck even existed. However, I did have that idea…

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