“After extensive consultation, discussion, and deliberation, the American Muslim 2024 Election Task Force has decided to encourage American Muslims to vote for any presidential candidate of their choosing who supports a permanent ceasefire in Gaza and a US arms embargo on the Israeli government, such as candidates Dr Jill Stein, Dr Cornel West or Chase Oliver,” read the statement, obtained by Middle East Eye.

The statement was written by the American Muslim 2024 Election Task Force, an umbrella group formed this year that consists of a number of prominent Muslim organisations including the political arms of Americans for Justice in Palestine (AJP), Cair, and the US Council of Muslim Organizations.

“We cannot endorse Vice President Kamala Harris’ candidacy because of her refusal to even consider imposing the arms embargo on the Israeli government required by US laws and her failure to promise any other changes whatsoever to President Biden’s failed policy of steadfast financial, diplomatic and military support for Israel’s genocide in Gaza,” the statement read.

-2 points

Let me just say to those who say voting for a third party candidate is a waste of a vote, it is not. Either way, the person who wins will see how many votes that candidate got, and will know that that is the way many people FEEL about a specific issue. Then they will have to cater to that view in someway.

permalink
report
reply
-4 points

Haaaaahahahhahaaaaahhaahahhaahahhaaahahahahhaaaaaa. That’s the funniest joke I’ve heard in a long time. I agree that neither Harris or Trump have the best interests of Palestinians at heart but Harris will make at least some saber rattling to try to stem the bloodshed vs Trump who will be happy to sell more weapons to anyone who wants to wipe Palestine off the map.

permalink
report
parent
reply
3 points

Harris will make at least some saber rattling to try to stem the bloodshed

Haaaaahahahhahaaaaahhaahahhaahahhaaahahahahhaaaaaa. That’s the funniest joke I’ve heard in a long time.

permalink
report
parent
reply
2 points

Extremely naive, that doesn’t actually happen.

permalink
report
parent
reply
0 points

No? What has Biden’s position on the border or economy been? You really want to tell me the Biden Administration or its successors aren’t banking on that? Or that right now tfg isn’t avoiding the question about abortion, because his party members that ran against pro-choice lost in swing states like Arizona and Nevada?

permalink
report
parent
reply
0 points
*

Wrong, electoral college has you on rails in the U.S. there are no thirds and never have been.

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

WeLl AcKThUaLLy, Ross Perot got really close in the 1992 &1996 election and his views on taxing the wealthy to eleminate national debt were followed through by the Clinton administration, the last administration that had a surplus, not a deficit, that Al Gore wanted to put in a lockbox. But yeah, if it weren’t for the electoral college, Gore would have been elected, and we’d probably be better off rn

permalink
report
parent
reply
-1 points
*

How many electoral votes did ole Ross get?

Since tankies thrive on open questions I will answer myself. 0 , H. Ross Perot got 0 electoral votes in his only full candidacy for president. That is the % chance that a third party candidate has in the U.S. For anyone not familiar with U.S. elections that wishes to chime in.

permalink
report
parent
reply
30 points

Smart.

We should give trump another turn… that’ll be good for Muslims I bet.

permalink
report
reply
-17 points

Hey, bud, I’m betting the actual Muslims who are affected probably have a better grasp of the situation and their values and associated risks/benefits behind their own advocacy and politics than your (presumably highly privileged) disconnected-from-their-struggle self; and inserting yourself to belittle them as if you know better than they theymselfs what’s ‘good for them,’ is a very chauvinist and colonialist outlook and a reinforcement of white supremacist norms and attitudes. You should try listening rather than projecting and belittling.

permalink
report
parent
reply
7 points
*

Unfortunately we have a 2 party system.

A or B

A sucks and B is much worse

Voting for C or abstaining is a passive endorsement of the greater of the two sucks.

If you and the Muslim community want to hump for a third party, good, let’s fucken talk about getting that started…

The day AFTER Election Day. —

permalink
report
parent
reply
11 points

The day after election day. The day on which you no longer have any leverage.

Liberals and an inability to grasp electoralism. Name a more iconic duo.

permalink
report
parent
reply
-2 points

Today is after election day, buddy. You had your chance to listen to those actually effected by trump and Biden. You didn’t and think everyone magically forgot what trump was like, so you try to scare monger so your chosen neoliberal nightmare grey’s elected and nothing improves ever.

permalink
report
parent
reply
5 points

The two party system still allows voters to pressure politicians into appealing to them.

When the amount of people withholding their vote grows large enough, one of the two parties will cave to win over their vote. They cannot win an election on thin air.

The question now is whether this important swing-state voter group is appealing enough for Democrats to cave, or they believe they can beat Trump without them.

permalink
report
parent
reply
7 points

Why would anyone who gets elected start catering when they are most unaccountable?

permalink
report
parent
reply
9 points

None of that has anything to do with it.

This is the issue at hand: https://youtu.be/s7tWHJfhiyo

There’s a legitimate mathematical limitation on 3rd parties under first past the post voting, the way America does elections. Until we get ranked choice voting and the ability to vote intelligently that it would unlock, failing to vote for Kamala is voting for trump.

permalink
report
parent
reply
-1 points

failing to vote for Kamala is voting for trump.

No, it’s literally not. A vote for Trump is a vote for Trump. A vote for Cornel West or Jill Stein is exactly a vote for Cornel West or Jill Stein.

If you want to argue the math and the practicality of who people vote for in our current system, fine, but don’t gaslight people by telling them that their vote for one candidate is actually a vote for a different candidate.

permalink
report
parent
reply
4 points
*

“failing to vote for Kamala is voting for trump.”

By that same logic a vote for Harris is a vote against Jill Stein or Cornel West. -I actually like the Green Party, the candidate, and associated policy I’m voting for. –If all you’re concerned about is voting against Trump, then can you honestly argue that you actually like Harris? -I’m betting your answer is ‘no’ seeing that out of ~12 candidates she ranked somewhere behind a wet-blanket in the 2020 Democrat primaries.

permalink
report
parent
reply
-2 points

Did you just assume their religion?!? And nationality? And race?

Shut the fuck up.

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point
*

I don’t know, if Iceland were doing something that would impact me, I don’t know if I have a good enough grasp on Icelands political system to make good strategic decisions.

The idea that because someone is hurt by something they would automatically know the best course of action is sorta nonsense. If a bear attacks me and a biologist that studies bears shouts advice at me, going “you fucking chauvinist colonialist asshole, the bear isn’t even attacking you, stay in your lane!” is probably a bad course of action.

America, one of the most powerful nations on earth, has one of the weirdest compromise ass backwards electoral systems on earth. I imagine a lot of Palestinians trying to survive right now aren’t having a ton of free time to brush up on the mechanics of the electoral college and the nuances of electoral politics. When the people they trust to do that in their name tell them “adopt a strategy that means your voice will be completely silenced” it might be a good time to assess whether or not they got that one right.

permalink
report
parent
reply
10 points

There was an article posted in another magazine thread that spoke about needing to iterate America’s core values. What are they? Freedom to starve and be homeless, or be locked up and become a chattel slave, or work several jobs as s wage slave; freedom of press owned by a handful of superwealthy people and corporations, many of whom are in the energy and arms industries; freedom of low quality food that contain carcinogenic pesticide residues, colors, flavors and growth hormones and routine antibiotics. Freedom to die from easily treatable conditions because you can’t afford care of medications, even if you purchase mandated Medicare?

Justice? For whom? The people who are incarcerated because of fabricated evidence of having to take plea deals because you can’t afford a good lawyer? The ones executed, despite exculpatory evidence? How about executive branch government members who lead insurrection, or legislators that make insider trading legal for themselves but not us, or of the legislative branch who take gifts of great monetary value and have loans forgiven?

How about too big to fail industries?

Freedom of speech? Two tiered.

Profit at the expense of all else; making sure the USD remains the world reserve currency, by manufacturing fake wmds to invade a sovereign nation, so that nation would not convert their UN food-for-oil account from petrodollar to Petroeuro? Taking foreign money to defeat more progressive candidates that would absolutely vote not to support genocide with money, weapons, air support? Conveniently forgetting concern over certain nations’ infatuation with Nazi idealism to continue the tired red scare propaganda?

Guns!

What are America’s core values?

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

Ummm you’re arguing with a bit/troll. Why waste your time effort.

permalink
report
parent
reply
43 points

And if they bleed away enough people from Harris, that guarantees a Trump win. A 3rd party cannot win. The only alternative to Harris is Trump.

You know, the guy who wants Israel to kill people faster:

https://apnews.com/article/trump-biden-israel-pr-hugh-hewitt-21faee332d95fec99652c112fbdcd35d

“They’re losing the PR war. They’re losing it big. But they’ve got to finish what they started, and they’ve got to finish it fast, and we have to get on with life.”

Who wants to revoke the citizenship from Americans:

https://www.aclu.org/documents/trump-administrations-plan-strip-citizenship-thousands-americans

Detain them in concentration camps:

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-does-not-rule-out-building-detention-camps-mass-deportations-2024-04-30/

And do the same thing to Mexico that Israel does to Lebanon:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_occupation_of_Southern_Lebanon

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/donald-trump-mexico-military-cartels-war-on-drugs-1234705804/

permalink
report
reply
31 points

Sounds like Harris needs to try to win back disaffected Muslim-Americans turned away by her promise to continue genocide.

permalink
report
parent
reply
-1 points

No, it sounds like disaffected people need to stop helping Trump win and start thinking.

permalink
report
parent
reply
19 points

It sounds like the Democrats need to stop aiding and abetting genocide if they want their votes.

permalink
report
parent
reply
20 points

Easy to say when you aren’t the target. It is the job of a politician to win over voters they are shedding.

Your line of thinking is that over half of Muslim-American voters simply “aren’t thinking,” which borders on racist. Instead, think about why they are doing what they are doing, and how that can change.

permalink
report
parent
reply
22 points

Ah yes, it’s never the candidate’s fault. Only the voters can be to blame.

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point
Deleted by creator
permalink
report
parent
reply
-4 points

Problem: She’s not advocating for continued genocide:

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/harris-face-black-journalists-questions-philadelphia-2024-09-17/

Speaking in Philadelphia to the National Association of Black Journalists, she called for a ceasefire between Israel and Palestinian Hamas militants, a two-state solution and Middle East stability in a way that does not empower Iran.

Repeatedly:

https://www.npr.org/2024/08/23/g-s1-19232/kamala-harris-israel-gaza-dnc

She and President Biden are still pushing for a cease-fire deal that sees the hostages released, the fighting in Gaza to end and so “Palestinian people can realize their right to dignity, security, freedom and self determination.”

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cn0lx2xgn55o

Ms Harris said “far too many” civilians had been killed "yet again"and reiterated calls for a hostage deal and a ceasefire, echoing comments made by the White House.

None of that is “pro-genocide”.

permalink
report
parent
reply
17 points

This is a continuation of Biden’s genocidal policies, not a new promise to end the genocide. The DNC is losing heavily in optics, so they are trying to fight optics with empty promises while maintaning unending support for Israel’s “Right to Defend Itself.” If you have any knowledge of Israel’s existence as a settler-colonial apartheid state, or why the US will always support it, then you know that Harris’s promises are hollow and empty, and signify continued genocide.

Here’s a simple thought experiment: why has the US historically supported Israel, and how would that change?

permalink
report
parent
reply
-3 points
*

Problem: She’s not advocating for continued genocide

Have you seen the vassal state comment up thread? He thinks the US has absolute control over Israel and that the war in Gaza is an expression of Biden and Harris’ will.

This is not a productive conversation.

permalink
report
parent
reply
11 points

Starts off saying Trump is worse and then turns to straight up lying and misinformation. Classic.

permalink
report
parent
reply
20 points
*

No, Harris and the Biden administration are pretending to push for a ceasefire deal, and Harris is pretending to give a shit about Palestinian civilians. They could have stopped this at any time with a phone call; it’s been done before.

permalink
report
parent
reply
17 points
*

How do you achieve those things without a weapons embargo? Harris has said that there will never be an embargo.

She hasn’t even given the vaguest clue as to what her plan is. She’s just “working on it”. “24/7”, she says, and yet she somehow still has time to go to rallies.

To add insult to injury, the Democrats wouldn’t even allow a Palestinian-American to speak during their convention. They allowed a bunch of Republicans to speak, but not a single Palestinian-American Democrat.

I heard the speech that the Palestinian-American rep wanted to give. There was nothing in it that should’ve upset the DNC. It didn’t even mention an embargo!

If the Democrats keep spitting in your face, how long do you keep giving them your votes?

permalink
report
parent
reply
20 points

The Biden admin has corrupted “ceasefire” to mean “pause in the fighting to get the hostages back”. Biden has made a big show of cursing out Bibi on the phone and other performative bullshit, but he has not strayed from Israel’s side even as they’ve betrayed him and promoted Trump. Harris is the same, giving lip service to human rights activists and bombs to genociders.

permalink
report
parent
reply
11 points

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_support_for_Israel_in_the_Israel–Hamas_war

What they are saying and what they are doing differ. Not only they are evil but they are also liars. They are lying to you too jordanlund.

permalink
report
parent
reply
6 points

You know, the guy who wants Israel to kill people faster:

Biden sidestepped around congress twice to shovel guns and bombs to them faster than even the bloodthirsty Zionists in Congress could — who were already themselves bipartisanly moving to do the same. He 100% wanted Gazans wiped off the face of the earth before the elections hit. The only difference between them here is that Trump is being honest (dig that, your “lesser evil” is somehow being more duplicitous and dishonest than Donald Trump). You fixate on rhetoric and ignore tangible actions. Palestinians have said that both parties are the same for them. We can see it in policy. They’re the same for us in most cases, only difference being Trump doesn’t rely on working class margins to be given a mandate like the Democrats do.

Detain them in concentration camps:

So does Biden… In fact, so did Obama. In fact Obama was known amongst immigrant rights groups as the “Deporter-in-Chief” because of how draconian he was in both detainment and deportation policy. And Biden not only didn’t shut down the concentration camps, but deregulated them and allowed for and advertised with state money the private subcontracting of these concentration camps for private profit. Which is somehow worse than Trump was.

I wouldn’t use this talking point because this whole presidency and openly now in-campaign has seen Dems try actively to outflank the Republicans on the right of immigration. He issued an executive order to fully close the border, a thing that was egregious enough that the courts blocked it for Trump. But now that it’s Biden it’s okay by you? Where do your political standards lie? Unless you’re just ill-informed, it feels like you’re just concern-trolling. And like the refugees to Europe, they’re fleeing from the bipartisan destruction, terror, debt-crises, and chaos caused by US empire.

Who wants to revoke the citizenship from Americans:

That’s something he tried in 2018, and while bad, is not ‘unilaterally revoking citizenship of Americans’ like your non-description insinuates, but was the DHS forwarding more denaturalization cases than used to be to the DoJ, where the actual process takes place, as ICE intended to review a lot more cases. These institutions are bipartisanly this way, and we’re seeing how Biden is increasing this regardless. Besides, the scale of this 2018 thing was very small compared to things right now that you’re distracting from; like the current genocide, homicidal and violent and for-profit border policies stricter than even Trump, homicidal nuclear brinksmanship and proxy wars by the democrats which are much more impactful and serious. And besides, Obama also drone striked US citizens. And more US citizens are in bi-partisan-supported prison than any citizenry in any country in history, imprisoned with a profit incentive, where they are in cases legally (read the 13th amendment) worked as slaves in the mass-incarceration prison-industrial complex, whose architect and primary instigator was none other than Joe Biden and the Democrat Clinton administration of which this campaign, now replacement-headed by Top Cop Kamala Handcuffs is a continuing rightward legacy of.

Biden also, incidentally, helped create and push the Patriot act and has never stopped expanding funding and power to the DHS, ICE, NSA, CIA, FBI, Pentagon, etc. Kamala has no intention either, as Black organizers have been raided and burned out by the FBI on false ‘espionage act’ charges under Democrat governance. As anti-genocide protestors for Palestine are being violently repressed and arrested en masse and demonized or infantilized by Kamala, Dems and republicans, and corporate media. As poor people are being brutalized and arrested over $1.75 public transit costs in Democrat New York after the deployment of hundreds of cops to sit and watch turnstyles. As domestic workers are increasingly broken and lumpenized under the guns of of the ever-expanding fascistic police state set up and supported bipartisanly by the institutions and increasingly militarized under both parties. I mean Walz sent an army into Minneapolis to crush uprisings and to protect (mostly white-owned) property and institutions after the police murder of George Floyd, with the old “outside agitators” shtick.

And do the same thing to Mexico that Israel does to Lebanon:

This is incoherent; an empty comparison with surface level understanding (at most) about these nations and their situations. It’s also empty pandering by Trump and the most unhinged handful of Republicans who ride this kind of rhetoric (MTG, Graham, etc.). Trump’s not going to start a war with Mexico, and neither will the military establishment. Just like noone’s going to nuke Iran because the southern-belle-Holden-Bloodfeast that is Lindsay Graham slams his fist and hollers about it to rile up his base, This is a silly thing to get your underwear in knots over, especially when there’s real things you’re avoiding instead.

As far as actions: we’re closer to WW3 than ever, with Biden’s nuclear brinksmanship fueled by arms-dealers; we’re witnessing the most televized genocide in history, a continuation of bipartisan genocidal foreign policy

Biden in his first months of office to keep the region in chaos and suffering after everything they’ve done to keep it so for decades, straight up stole half of Afghanistan’s assets and crushed them with sanctions knowingly killing untellable tens of thousands of Afghan children and counting.

You fixate on rhetoric and ignore action, and by appeasement you serve to legitimize the “two party” charade for all the billionaire imperialist exploiters, racketeers, murderers, and liars who both parties are funded by, speak for, and work for.

V. I. LeninPolitical Parties in Russia

To see what is what in the fight between the parties, one must not take words at their face value but must study the actual history of the parties, must study not so much what they say about themselves as their deeds, the way in which they go about solving various political problems, and their behaviour in matters affecting the vital interests of the various classes of society—landlords, capitalists, peasants, workers, etc.

The greater the degree of political liberty in a country and the more stable and democratic its representative institutions, the easier it is for the mass of the people to find its bearings in the fight between the parties and to learn politics, i.e., to expose the deception and find out the truth.

permalink
report
parent
reply
2 points
*

Did you forget that Biden isn’t on the ballot anymore?

permalink
report
parent
reply
19 points

Maybe democrats should’ve thought of that before participating in a genocide.

permalink
report
parent
reply
9 points

Are any of these people actually relevant? Because this is not how you get your way, so I really hope they are not representing any actual constituent communities.

permalink
report
reply
26 points

What do you propose Muslim-Americans do to stop genocide?

Either way, Muslim-Americans make up a significant population in Michigan, enough to sway the swing state. Harris is playing with fire with her commitment to maintaining the Party Line on genocide.

permalink
report
parent
reply
5 points
*

I think you can figure this one out if you try.

Telling your members to vote third party six weeks before the election is the exact opposite of that.

This is saying “we have no power, we give up”.

permalink
report
parent
reply
9 points

I think you can figure this one out if you try.

Seems like you’re hinting that they should just accept that genocide is a fact of life for Muslims, instead of pressuring to change it. Easy to say when you aren’t the target.

Telling your members to vote third party six weeks before the election is the exact opposite of that.

Stein has been polling ahead of Harris for months with Muslim-American voters, this isn’t a new thing. Harris has had the time and information to pivot, and hasn’t.

permalink
report
parent
reply
21 points

Voting for Harris is saying “we have no power, we give up”. It’s allowing the Democratic Party to deteriorate further into an imperialist party. They’re going to get so much worse if they come to believe they can kill unlimited Palestinians and face zero consequences.

permalink
report
parent
reply
13 points

CAIR and USCMO are the biggest Muslim organizations in the U.S. In negotiations Democrats were unwilling to make any concessions for Palestine. Voting for Harris anyway would be counterproductive.

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

Trump does have a plan to end the suffering of the Palestinians, forever.

permalink
report
parent
reply
12 points
*

Trump doesn’t have any plans. He just does whatever dumb bullshit pops in his head.

permalink
report
parent
reply
10 points

Yeah, the same one Harris does, because they both unconditionally support the genocide! It’s not like Trump would invade Palestine (short of a broader regional conflict)

permalink
report
parent
reply
18 points

This is basically a self fulfilling prophecy. People are told that they can only vote for one of the two parties which makes every other candidate irrelevant.

permalink
report
parent
reply
25 points

They want Trump to get elected? Because this is how you get Trump elected.

permalink
report
reply
2 points

Yeup. Who would’ve thought that supporting genocide would come back to bite you in the ass, huh?

permalink
report
parent
reply

United States | News & Politics

!usa@lemmy.ml

Create post

Community stats

  • 4.8K

    Monthly active users

  • 1.7K

    Posts

  • 11K

    Comments