45 points

Drugs won the war!

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42 points

And just like most wars, it was bullshit that it was fought in the first place and the largest source of casualties was innocents.

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6 points

They needed some excuse to give hippies felonies so they couldn’t vote

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7 points

Don’t forget black and brown people. White conservatives hate it when anyone but them participate in democracy

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62 points

Shit I thought that became the case when Illinois passed its recreational law.

Will police have to retire police dogs if they still react to weed?

Yes. Police dogs “alerting” on something that isn’t illegal, in a way that is indistinguishable from “alerting” on something that is illegal, are no longer qualified to be drug sniffers.

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43 points

That makes it no different than it already is, most of those dogs will “alert” whenever they’re signaled regardless whether they smell anything. Information online suggests anywhere between a 26-44% positive ID rate though numbers on that seem a bit sketchy from different sources.

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15 points

Hence the quotes around “alert.” I chose to keep my previous comment about accurate dog sniffs in order to address the question of “police dogs that react to weed even though the smell of weed is not illegal.” Inaccurate sniffs are a completely valid, but separate concern.

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4 points

Fair enough, point taken.

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75 points

That’s good. The article talks about how K9’s should be handled with the legalization of weed. Should they be retired if they still respond to weed, etc.

Of course K9’s aren’t trained to actually smell anything. They’re just trained to respond to an officers command, giving police the freedom to search any vehicle they please.

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-36 points

Of course K9’s aren’t trained to actually smell anything

Can we stop with the conspiracy theories please? This is just stupid.

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49 points
*

There was a study done where police K9 units where told they’d be testing the accuracy of the dog’s ability to find drugs. In actuality, they were testing the handlers. Handlers were told drugs were hidden in a certain location, but there wasn’t actually drugs there. Despite that, all their dogs alerted several times to the location the handlers were told about.

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-2 points

I’ve looked at several of these studies today and they all prove without a doubt that handlers have an effect on their dogs’ behavior, but they don’t prove that the dogs don’t have the ability to detect what they say they can. That might become useless policy-wise if the police can nearly always cause the dog to alert, but science-wise it’s dishonest to say that the dogs can’t smell anything.

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60 points

It’s a fact that they have an extremely high false-positive rate. Whether that’s intentional or not doesn’t change the fact that it serves law enforcement’s interests.

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-7 points
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I suppose that’s true, but that doesn’t mean that they don’t smell anything. Your conclusion may be correct, but your initial claim isn’t, and that’s something I’m seeing on lemmy more than I’d like to.

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9 points

Knew a k9 cop. He freely admitted this is how it works.

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9 points

No, you’re right. I do believe they’re trained to detect things, and thought about editing it, but I stuck with the poor wording.

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3 points

I appreciate this, apologies for sounding a bit hostile

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1 point

They are trained for it. That doesn’t mean they can do it well.

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12 points

Cool. Now revoke QI!

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36 points
*

This is the police … if you get pulled over by a jerk of an officer, they’ll find a different excuse to search your vehicle … or at the very least hold you up, get you out of your car and generally give you a hard time.

Do your lights work? How’s your tire treadwear? Is your documentation up to date? You were driving about five over the limit. This is a ride check.

And one of the worst questions I absolutely hate being asked by a cop … “Where are you going?”

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22 points

Remember, they are asking if they can search your vehicle. You are allowed to say no. Then they must justify an arrest

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29 points

It’s an imbalance of power.

If a guy with a gun and a license to kill … which is basically what a police officer is … if they start asking questions, I’m answering politely.

I’m not going to argue with them or disagree with them … even if I say ‘no’ I’m still at risk based on the personality of the cop.

I’m also a big brown skinned long haired indigenous person so whenever I get stopped by a cop … I’m doing what I’m told or I risk getting beaten, arrested or even shot.

This is also the reason why I placed four different cameras with audio around my vehicle.

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18 points

Okay, that is absolutely fair, and I do not blame you one bit for doing what you have to do to stay safe.

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14 points

Same brother. Fellow brown dude… I’ve been pulled over because my ‘car sounded like it was being driven drunk.’ Yeah, let that set in… I didn’t argue at all - I was well within my rights, but I didn’t know if he gave a shit about my rights or not and his rationale for pulling me over suggested not to press my luck.

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21 points

“Am I being detained?”

“I do not consent to any search of my person or property.”

“I am exercising my right to remain silent.”

“I will not answer any further questions without an attorney present.”

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17 points

These should all be burned into everyone’s brain (even if some shitheads have made “Am I being detained?” into a joke, it is still valid).

With regard to refusing to answer questions and searches:

  • Your right to remain silent must be actively expressed in order to exercise it. Simply being silent without active verbal exercise of that right can be interpreted as “confrontational behavior.”
  • Depending on the circumstances, there are some questions that you are obliged to answer. If you are driving a car, you are required to produce your driver’s license. You may be required to identify yourself with name and birthdate, even if you are not driving a car.
  • There are a couple of different kinds of search. One kind is a “pat down.” This is where the officer is allowed to feel over your clothes (not inside pockets) to check for weapons, and this generally does not require any probable cause or reasonable suspicion. Any other kind of search of person or property does require probable cause, or comes after an arrest. “I do not consent to any search.” If the officer is asking for your consent, they don’t have cause (yet).
  • Be aware that you are only required to be Mirandized if the police are going to ask you questions about whatever situation they have you as a suspect or person of interest in. But you always have those rights, whether they have been read to you or not, and police may ask you questions which are “adjacent” to the situation without Mirandizing you - in the hopes that you simply offer incriminating information.

If the police want to talk to you, it’s Shut the Fuck Up Day.

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9 points
*

Don’t forget, ridiculous as it is, you have to say “my attorney”, based on https://reason.com/2011/03/08/tennessee-cops-posed-as-a-defe/

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13 points

You are.

And they are also allowed to then say they smell something and bring in a dog that responds to their commands to establish a “hit” to justify searching anyway.

If its not the smell of weed, it will just be a different smell that they claim. The issue is your rejection of their search is functionally meaningless.

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-1 points
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Not consenting to a police search doesn’t stop the search, and that’s ok.

What it does is make the fruits of that search inadmissable, and may also enable you to sue them if the search was unreasonable or excessive, or the pretext violated your rights.

Even if you know you don’t have anything in your car, verbally and clearly say that you don’t consent to the search, and would like them to note that fact, but otherwise comply. Lots of people have been caught up by police planting evidence, and you don’t want to be one of them.

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9 points

This might not be completely true, but I was told by a former cop that technically anything obscuring the driver’s view through the windshield is something they can use against you. Hanging air fresheners, bobble heads, a mounted dash cam… it’s just one of those things that isn’t usually enforced.

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“Where are you going?”

Chaotic neutral: To a lecture on the 4th amendment.

Chaotic evil: Your mom’s house.

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7 points

you are under no obligation to tell them where you’re going/have been.

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9 points

Whenever I start disagreeing with an officer or telling them I don’t have to answer any questions … the response is usually that I have an attitude and that they don’t like my behavior.

It’s subtle intimidation because they know that if I stand up for myself long and hard enough … they’ll detain/ arrest or use force, ask questions after and justify their actions later.

It’s easier to walk a fine line between complying and trying not to upset a bully with a gun.

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3 points

This is the way. In my experience it’s been better to act like their friend while still being mindful of what information you’re giving (strictly talking about traffic stops). But for sure if they seem to suspect you of a crime it becomes STFU Friday. It also helps to keep your hands on the wheel and be white.

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