To clarify, I think it’s when you help other people without expectation of reward.
A libertarian cop would happily save your life from an angry grizzly bear if you paid them for the cost of bullets used, services rendered, and the bear disposal fee.
Obligatory Libertarian Police Department
spoiler
I was shooting heroin and reading “The Fountainhead” in the front seat of my privately owned police cruiser when a call came in. I put a quarter in the radio to activate it. It was the chief.
“Bad news, detective. We got a situation.”
“What? Is the mayor trying to ban trans fats again?”
“Worse. Somebody just stole four hundred and forty-seven million dollars’ worth of bitcoins.”
The heroin needle practically fell out of my arm. “What kind of monster would do something like that? Bitcoins are the ultimate currency: virtual, anonymous, stateless. They represent true economic freedom, not subject to arbitrary manipulation by any government. Do we have any leads?”
“Not yet. But mark my words: we’re going to figure out who did this and we’re going to take them down … provided someone pays us a fair market rate to do so.”
“Easy, chief,” I said. “Any rate the market offers is, by definition, fair.”
He laughed. “That’s why you’re the best I got, Lisowski. Now you get out there and find those bitcoins.”
“Don’t worry,” I said. “I’m on it.”
I put a quarter in the siren. Ten minutes later, I was on the scene. It was a normal office building, strangled on all sides by public sidewalks. I hopped over them and went inside.
“Home Depot™ Presents the Police!®” I said, flashing my badge and my gun and a small picture of Ron Paul. “Nobody move unless you want to!” They didn’t.
“Now, which one of you punks is going to pay me to investigate this crime?” No one spoke up.
“Come on,” I said. “Don’t you all understand that the protection of private property is the foundation of all personal liberty?”
It didn’t seem like they did.
“Seriously, guys. Without a strong economic motivator, I’m just going to stand here and not solve this case. Cash is fine, but I prefer being paid in gold bullion or autographed Penn Jillette posters.”
Nothing. These people were stonewalling me. It almost seemed like they didn’t care that a fortune in computer money invented to buy drugs was missing.
I figured I could wait them out. I lit several cigarettes indoors. A pregnant lady coughed, and I told her that secondhand smoke is a myth. Just then, a man in glasses made a break for it.
“Subway™ Eat Fresh and Freeze, Scumbag!®” I yelled.
Too late. He was already out the front door. I went after him.
“Stop right there!” I yelled as I ran. He was faster than me because I always try to avoid stepping on public sidewalks. Our country needs a private-sidewalk voucher system, but, thanks to the incestuous interplay between our corrupt federal government and the public-sidewalk lobby, it will never happen.
I was losing him. “Listen, I’ll pay you to stop!” I yelled. “What would you consider an appropriate price point for stopping? I’ll offer you a thirteenth of an ounce of gold and a gently worn ‘Bob Barr ‘08’ extra-large long-sleeved men’s T-shirt!”
He turned. In his hand was a revolver that the Constitution said he had every right to own. He fired at me and missed. I pulled my own gun, put a quarter in it, and fired back. The bullet lodged in a U.S.P.S. mailbox less than a foot from his head. I shot the mailbox again, on purpose.
“All right, all right!” the man yelled, throwing down his weapon. “I give up, cop! I confess: I took the bitcoins.”
“Why’d you do it?” I asked, as I slapped a pair of Oikos™ Greek Yogurt Presents Handcuffs® on the guy.
“Because I was afraid.”
“Afraid?”
“Afraid of an economic future free from the pernicious meddling of central bankers,” he said. “I’m a central banker.”
I wanted to coldcock the guy. Years ago, a central banker killed my partner. Instead, I shook my head.
“Let this be a message to all your central-banker friends out on the street,” I said. “No matter how many bitcoins you steal, you’ll never take away the dream of an open society based on the principles of personal and economic freedom.”
He nodded, because he knew I was right. Then he swiped his credit card to pay me.
Why Penn Jillette though? Is he for some reason popular with libertarians?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penn_Jillette#Politics
Jillette has previously identified as a libertarian, and stated in 2003 that he may consider himself an anarcho-capitalist. He was a fellow at the libertarian think tank the Cato Institute.
People focus on the bears thing, and not that most of the libertarians who joined the Free Town Project were men (wonder why women didn’t feel safe joining; it’s a mystery), and many (surprise surprise) turned out to be sexual predators or even murderers. They also quickly (and deliberately) bankrupted the town through budget cuts and spurious lawsuits, making life worse for everyone who lived there. The whole thing was a shitshow. Who knew that a philosophy of self-centeredness would attract the worst sort of people?
Libertarianism. Not even once.
We focus on the bears thing because that’s the unexpected, humorous part, as humor is about subverting expectations. The rest of it—sexual predators, budget cuts/bankruptcy, antisocial behavior, declining quality of life—is exactly what most people expect from a libertarian town experiment. It’s the bears that turn a depressing shitshow into a hilarious shitshow.
But is it really help if it is necessarily transactional? I wouldn’t say my mechanic helped by fixing my car because I paid him. If my neighbor fixed my car, I’d say he helped me.
I think the concept of “hired help” is a thing, at least. They’re not helping you out of the goodness of their heart, but they are helping you because they’re being paid to. If my mechanic is able to solve a car issue that I struggled with for a while on my own, I’d still call that a help even when the relationship is entirely transactional.
I think what you’re describing with the neighbor is more like doing a favor, if I were to put words to it.
Plus it’s a psychological trick “Hey, if you help me out with this, I can help you with this”. That tells the person you want their help, and you are willing to help them. That’s a transaction as well, and improves relationships
Big L, not little l. Big L is the party, little l can vary wildly, even starting out along the lines of anti-state socialists / social anarchists.
Like so many things, the modern right in the US has polluted the meaning.
For example, left libertarians will support redistribution of resources, support of green policies, and is strongly anti-war.
The Libertarian Party is just maga that… Well some of them think smoking weed is fine. And they dont want to pay taxes.
Universal healthcare, universal education to a collegiate level, and UBI replacing most/all welfare results in much less government interference/involvement and results in the greatest individual freedom via geographical/socioeconomic/employment mobility.
It’s also not incompatible with capitalism, and in fact the increased mobility will spur more entrepreneurialism.
Well, under a Libertarian model, t*xes are a dirty word.
It’s “unfair” that you should have to help support public services that you might need someday, so it’s better to push the full burden of cost on the specific people who need it at any given moment.
Insurance is fine though, which is basically privatized taxes. There’d probably be cop and bear insurance plans available in a perfect Libertarian world, so those with good foresight and the means to afford them wouldn’t have to worry about having to pay to have their life saved.
As long as, you know, the situation also doesn’t include the following criteria:
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Only 1-3 bullets are covered by the plan, after which the policy holder is responsible for the full cost of any subsequent bullets used.
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The policy covers the services of [1] officer at standard working rate. Additional cost due to surge pricing rates will be covered by the policy holder. One additional officer will be covered by the policy at a rate of 50%, with the remaining 50% covered by the policy holder. Any additional officer fees are the full responsibility of the policy holder to cover.
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Bear disposal is covered in full by the policy, for bears up to 200kg. For bears greater than 200kg, the policy will pay 20% per additional pound up to 50lbs, after which the policy holder pays a flat rate of $50 per additional stone of bear.
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The policy does not cover bear- or officer-related damages to your person.
Well, under a Libertarian model, t*xes are a dirty word.
I identify as some sort of a libertarian. My idea of the ideology is that taxes are gathered to fund essential services that cannot be resourced in better ways. Just about everybody who’s not insane or an asshole agrees that police, military, judicial system, assistance for less fortunate, some infrastructure (edit: + emergency services like fire brigades and I’m sure I forgot something else too) are part of that, while schooling, healthcare and certain natural monopolies are sometimes debated depending on how strict of a libertarian you are. Personally, I side on thinking that schools and natural monopolies should be publically owned and funded, whereas for healthcare I would model the system based on Switzerland’s, which is mostly privatized but works a lot better than USA’s.
Debt can be used to fund profitable investments (usually infrastructure and other one-time up-front investments like school buildings), not for upkeeping existing financial structures.
Things beyond those sectors probably should not be funded by taxes. Funding for housing, culture, private sector tax breaks/direct support, and sports (outside of youth sports possibly) are examples of some of such things. In fact, if you do fund other things by taxes, you’re essentially stealing resources from those essential services. Sometimes I wonder why so many people don’t seem to realize this.
The criticism of taxes is based on the idea that you, an individual should not be expected to pay taxes by force. Corporations, trade goods, products should be taxed and enforced, but tell a person "you have no choice and no option and there are serious legal troubles (fines, garnishments, jail time, etc…) is not just because you’re given no other option. The individual person is being forced to pay taxes because they were born in a certain region of the world?
Now let’s be pragmatic; it would take a lot of work, time, and money to change a taxing standard. However it is not right to force each head in a country to pay taxes.
Edit: Also even as a libertarian, I think most insurance is bullshit lol
Every time you help another person, a demon jabs Milton Friedman with a pitchfork.
I hate to nitpick but technically libertarians (especially small l, but even big L, which are different, and you used small l), are fine with helping people and mutual aid and altruism. What they have problems with is that being compulsory. They think that if you want to go help say the homeless or single mothers or animals or whatever your prerogative is, you should willingly donate your money to the cause if you have the money to spare and the will to share, but you should not be able to use the government to point a gun at some other guy to force him donate to your pet cause (i.e their view of taxes.)
I mean, there are certainly things to be said about that as well, some people believe helping others should be compulsory for example, and some things become a lot harder to organize without taxes, but it’s helpful to at least understand the actual argument of your opponent and argue against it coherently instead of pushing strawmen that make it seem as if you don’t entirely grasp their argument. A better example would be “any time taxes help someone a libertarian dies” for instance in this case.
So a three year old who crosses their arms, yells no, and falls to the floor.
i guess i gotta help people now. and that’s doubly altruistic because of all the children I’m going to save indirectly.
It’s such a convoluted philosophy it’s impossible to even say what it is because it means ten different things for ten different countries. In my country they are weird amalgamation of monarchists, conservatives and ultra-capitalist catholics but in Russia they like fight for lgbt rights.
No. Actually the philosophy is quite clear. The man who coined the term and was the first libertarian was a revolutionary in the French Revolution. The problem is so many people apply the noun to things that clash with the ideology.
Libertarians are not libertarian. Ideologically Libertarians often tend to be fascistic. But are so hyper self-centered. They do not buy into and will not participate in embracing any group identity.
I wish people stayed true to the original definition of words. Politics would be much easier to navigate. But alas who doesn’t do social manipulation these days: We are freedom fighters except we hate lgbt and are pro Catholicism and some even want return of monarchy vote for us!
The definition hasn’t changed. Soviet Russia a Marxist leninist Nation had a party called the Communist party. They were not communist. At least not outside of aspirationally. They were still Marxist leninist. But they rely on people easily being confused between nouns and adjectives
It’s such a meaningless term it’s impossible to even say what it is
Big “what even IS a racist?” energy 🙄
I don’t think that’s exactly fair, the term did get coopted by right wing anarcho-capitalists, so its had a pretty significant semantic shift from its left wing social anarchist origins.
There’s still left-libertarians in the world. You just have to specify now that anarcho-capitalists have appropriated the term, rather than pretend that no elaboration can possibly apply.
Having to be more specific when referring to other kinds of libertarians because of definition drift is annoying, sure, but it hardly makes the term meaningless.
