92 points
*

Yeah, Homeopathy is pseudoscience and a lot of diluting and banging things on a table and false claims. The placebo effect is proper science.

permalink
report
reply
61 points
*

Fun fact, Samuel Hahnemann was a pioneer in medical research. He was absolutely a quack, but in the absence of actual knowledge and understanding of physiology, his methods were at least rigorous. At the time, the practice of bloodletting was common, and he accurately decried the practice as doing more harm than good.

In his efforts to advance medical knowledge, the guy would ingest known poisons in small quantities and document how it made him feel. “This upsets my stomach, it must be good for indigestion, that one makes me cough, so it must be good for tuberculosis.” He was willing to injure himself to learn medicine. He also poisoned his colleagues, students, and healthy test subjects to further his research without killing himself.

The concept that like treats like was revolutionary. It was completely wrong, but it was not entirely irrational and it led to several important discoveries. The most famous example of a homeopathic success story is nitroglycerin. It causes heart palpitations, and has been one of the most successful heart attack interventions ever discovered.

Of course, we now have the scientific method, medical ethics, informed consent, and a much clearer understanding of human physiology and biology. We now know that homeopathy is crap. Even wt the time, dilution and succussion were entirely irrational, and anyone selling homeopathic remedies today ought to be charged with fraud. But still, it’s an interesting bit of medical and scientific history that most people dismiss entirely.

permalink
report
reply
22 points

People think a lot of things

permalink
report
reply
20 points

Placebos only work if the people think they’ll work. Funnily enough, it is possible to be aware something is a placebo and still expect it to work, but generally placebos involve some deception where the person thinks they’re receiving real treatment.

So yes, people selling homeopathic remedies are going to claim they’re real treatments, both to convince people to buy them, and because they’ll be most effective if people think they’re real. And the people buying them will also be the people who believe they’re actually effective, causing them to actually have an effect.

permalink
report
reply
25 points
*

Placebos only work if the people think they’ll work. Funnily enough, it is possible to be aware something is a placebo and still expect it to work,

Even if you know that it is a placebo, it still works. https://hms.harvard.edu/news/placebos-work-even-without-deception

I don’t know if you have to believe in the placebo effect for it to have an effect. :)

Homeopathy… do the sugar balls have a better effect if they are very expensive? Who knows.

permalink
report
parent
reply
8 points

Yeah, it would be a fine thing to sell to people, given that:

  • they don’t charge ridiculous prices for it, and
  • they never claim to be a treatment for any ailment that actually needs real treatment.
permalink
report
parent
reply
3 points

Yeah, not saying it’s not scummy business. It probably can be a decent treatment for non-serious conditions if the placebo effect gives the patient relief, but any serious condition will need real treatment.

permalink
report
parent
reply
0 points

but generally placebos involve some deception where the person thinks they’re receiving real treatment.

That’s literally what a placebo is…

Being aware that the placebo effect exists, and even being aware that someone is about to hand you something that may or may not be a placebo still doesn’t effect the chances of a placebo effect.

Like…

Do you think when placebos are used in studies that the patients aren’t aware that they may get an inactive treatment?

They literally have to sign contracts acknowledging that they’re aware of that fact in every medicinal trial…

Why doors such blatantly wrong information keep getting upvoted on Lemmy?

This is far from the first time I’ve seen this happen.

permalink
report
parent
reply
3 points

People know that they can get a placebo treatment, but they don’t know if they actually got a placebo or the real treatment. They’re also generally hoping both that they got the real treatment, and that the real treatment will make things better.

Maybe calling it deception isn’t fully accurate, but the the point is that they’re given something they hope is medicine, but in reality it’s the placebo treatment.

permalink
report
parent
reply
2 points
*

I think you misunderstood what you are replying to. Also you misunderstood the placebo effect (or maybe you think 50/50 placebo control group studies are the only application)

permalink
report
parent
reply
17 points

My father and stepmother were full tilt into this quackery. Today they don’t talk about it as much, but they do talk about politics an awful lot. I’ll let you figure out where they fall on the political spectrum.

permalink
report
reply

Today I Learned

!til@lemmy.world

Create post

What did you learn today? Share it with us!

We learn something new every day. This is a community dedicated to informing each other and helping to spread knowledge.

The rules for posting and commenting, besides the rules defined here for lemmy.world, are as follows:

Rules (interactive)


Rule 1- All posts must begin with TIL. Linking to a source of info is optional, but highly recommended as it helps to spark discussion.

** Posts must be about an actual fact that you have learned, but it doesn’t matter if you learned it today. See Rule 6 for all exceptions.**



Rule 2- Your post subject cannot be illegal or NSFW material.

Your post subject cannot be illegal or NSFW material. You will be warned first, banned second.



Rule 3- Do not seek mental, medical and professional help here.

Do not seek mental, medical and professional help here. Breaking this rule will not get you or your post removed, but it will put you at risk, and possibly in danger.



Rule 4- No self promotion or upvote-farming of any kind.

That’s it.



Rule 5- No baiting or sealioning or promoting an agenda.

Posts and comments which, instead of being of an innocuous nature, are specifically intended (based on reports and in the opinion of our crack moderation team) to bait users into ideological wars on charged political topics will be removed and the authors warned - or banned - depending on severity.



Rule 6- Regarding non-TIL posts.

Provided it is about the community itself, you may post non-TIL posts using the [META] tag on your post title.



Rule 7- You can't harass or disturb other members.

If you vocally harass or discriminate against any individual member, you will be removed.

Likewise, if you are a member, sympathiser or a resemblant of a movement that is known to largely hate, mock, discriminate against, and/or want to take lives of a group of people, and you were provably vocal about your hate, then you will be banned on sight.

For further explanation, clarification and feedback about this rule, you may follow this link.



Rule 8- All comments should try to stay relevant to their parent content.

Rule 9- Reposts from other platforms are not allowed.

Let everyone have their own content.



Rule 10- Majority of bots aren't allowed to participate here.

Unless included in our Whitelist for Bots, your bot will not be allowed to participate in this community. To have your bot whitelisted, please contact the moderators for a short review.



Partnered Communities

You can view our partnered communities list by following this link. To partner with our community and be included, you are free to message the moderators or comment on a pinned post.

Community Moderation

For inquiry on becoming a moderator of this community, you may comment on the pinned post of the time, or simply shoot a message to the current moderators.

Community stats

  • 5.3K

    Monthly active users

  • 458

    Posts

  • 9.3K

    Comments