There’s not a thing wrong with wanting a traditional family and traditional gender role life. A lot of people want that and life doesn’t have to be super complicated to be rewarding.
When you start spending all your time on the internet making monetized content about it and deliberately choosing to engage with the absolute worst people on the internet is where it becomes a suspect thing where the behavior doesn’t match the stated goal
There is something wrong with a traditional gender role life. Traditional gender roles are misogynist. Now, sure, a grown woman can consent to a BSDM lifestyle with her husband, that’s fine. But you do not involve your kids in that shit.
Traditional gender roles are bondage. They are. And if you have a relationship that practices BDSM as a lifestyle, you need to follow modern consent practices. Conservatives want to talk about kink at pride? Grooming children? That’s what this is. This is grooming. This is exposing children to your fetish and telling them it’s the lord’s plan for them.
There is something wrong with a traditional gender role life.
No there isn’t.
If a queer person is empowered to tell a conservative that “listen I’m gonna need you to STFU about my lifestyle choices, there’s not a thing wrong with them if that’s what I have decided to do” - which is 100% fair - then any person who feels that traditional gender roles suit them fine needs to be empowered to make the same STFU statement to anyone who’s somehow decided that they get to make the same determination on behalf of someone who just wants a family and kids and a farm somewhere, because they’ve decided that’s what will make them happy.
Misogyny is misogyny. “Normal” gender roles are different. Maybe the issue is a difference of definitions; there’s a certain amount of spousal abuse and authoritarianism that got written down as “traditional” by the ones that like to practice it. If that’s what you’re talking about or what you thought I meant by “traditional,” I will be fully in agreement with you that it’s fucked. What I am talking about is something different though.
Traditional gender roles are abusive 100% of the time. Now, if your transfemme polycule wants to play out a Stepford Wives kink fantasy (I am citing my own ex’s fetish), then that’s fine. That can be consensual. But if you’re talking about actual tradition, the actual relationships of the past, that shit is abusive no matter what.
We are talking about a system where you can’t divorce your husband if he beats you. Spousal rape isn’t real rape. Abortion is illegal. No painkillers during birth. No birth control. Women being sold off to other families. Treated as possessions. You can’t have a system of slavery and say that isn’t abusive. There are no good slaveowners. And there are no good traditional husbands. Many men of 100 years ago were good people who meant well and did their best to do well. But the system they lived in was innately abusive. For all the kindness and decency they gave their wives, they could not give their wives the freedom to choose another life. And that lack of freedom is abuse. Often not the husband’s fault, because he lived in a society where he was expected to behave that way.
But today, we have moved beyond those norms. So if a husband wants to go back to that old system and own his wife, then it is his fault. He is an abuser, no matter how kind or gentle. There is a way to make the appearance of a traditional relationship work as a kink. A way to ensure enthusiastic consent. There’s roleplay to be done. But it won’t actually be a traditional marriage. The people advocating actual traditional marriages, they want the abuse.
You’re just as much an anti choice bigot as the conservatives pushing trad life on people. If a woman makes a choice to stay at home to raise children, that’s valid and not “bondage”.
I didn’t say bondage was invalid. I said bondage without proper safety measures is invalid.
The woman was left to give birth alone. She had to self administer an epidural in secret. This shit ain’t vanilla!
Choosing to be a stay at home mom is fine and not bondage, that’s not what tradwife is. A tradwife chooses to be subservient to her husband and teaches her children that men are superior. Calling it a kink involving kids is letting it off lightly.
I don’t think traditional gender roles and BDSM should really be compared like that. But yes, patriarchal family life and domination are often the centerpieces.
In maths, you have two kinds of relationship between expressions. An equation is when they’re the same. A comparison is when they’re different.
You’re saying I compared BDSM and traditional gender roles, but I didn’t. I equated them. I said they’re the same. The patriarchy is a system of sexual domination. It’s a fetish.
You said not to compare BDSM and traditional gender roles, but I’ll ignore you and do it anyway now. What’s different about the two is that BDSM is supposed to be done with safe practices to ensure consent, and most people know it. Traditional gender roles have no safe practices. Nobody checks if the wife consents.
Traditional gender roles should be equal to BDSM. We should only be able to make equations between the two. We should not be able to compare them and say they’re different. We should be calling this “tradwife” meme a fetish, and pressuring the people who engage in it to practice safe consensual sex.
Plus, you know, equating tradwife bullshit with lefty deviancy is really gonna piss off some conservatives, and that’s worth doing all on its own.
I mean I’m cishet, but I kind of see your point, especially when kids are involved. Some specialisation of parental roles is fine ofc, but then some parents fall into pretty toxic, patriarchal roles, just because that’s how they were raised.
I’m talking like the woman taking on virtually all childcare and household labour and logistics (even when working), in such a way that they’re contributing much more into the relationship than their partner.
This - while I’d argue that feeding raw milk to children, for instance, is probably in violation of local statutes in most of the US, the overall premise isn’t necessarily invalid - the idea of forcing it on others and packaging/selling it as an influencer is what’s flawed.
My wife and I have a carefully negotiated relationship that is nowhere near tradwife, but not necessarily contemporary traditional either. I ended up in the hospital recently, and all that went out the window - she spoke for me, signed various forms of consent on my behalf, and the like as/when necessary.
The “tradwife” package seems to ignore that such moments will be necessary in any life, especially one with kids involved, and certainly any life that involves the risks of e.g., farm work. People get hurt and need consent for treatment, folks get sick and need to handle business over the phone but are unable to speak on their own behalf because they’re sick, etc.
From where I sit, anything resembling what the tradwife influencers are selling is completely invalid/impractical without an ‘escape hatch’ allowing the (generally) submissive spouse to take the reins as an when necessary and of their own volition… along with ensuring that said spouse has a functional understanding of how and when to do so, per the laws of their particular state.
Without that, you’re just playing a damned risky game that has a realistic chance of causing serious injury to one or more involved parties in the medium term.
It really annoys me how creepy misogynist awful people think they get to represent the traditional family.
I have a super traditional looking family. Stay at home mom and everything. But it is sick and disgusting to act like having a setup you enjoy means it’s the only valid one. You see, we care more about raising a decent and happy person than indoctrinating them into some belief system that focuses on who our enemies are.
Rejecting loving families because they look different than traditional does not make you the representatives of traditional, fucknuts.
the nuclear family and cisheteronormativity have been an absolute disaster for the human race
It’s amazing how many of these “trad” people are completely clueless that an isolated nuclear farming family isn’t traditional in the slightest.
kitchen table chairs outdoors in the grass is a recipe for a broken chair and a crying kid.
Funny if true, but if true possibly also a HIPAA violation. Wouldnt want the doctor to get in trouble, should probably skip any o’ them city folk inventions for the next 8 kids just to be safe.
Oof. Please don’t make jokes that villainize HIPAA. We have few enough privacy laws, as it is.
HIPAA, applied properly, means her husband shouldn’t have learned the details of her selected care, without her consent.
Edit: You were saying the same thing. I misunderstood.
What part of what i said villainized HIPAA?
Even if what you said is true, he just has to see the tweet for it to be a violation.
Data disclosure without authorization of the patient is a violation, and that doesn’t matter who its disclosed to.
Source I work in medtech, i do yearly trainings on handling patient data, and its unlikely im related to any of them 😅
Edit: to clarify… we are arguing about the doctor disclosing to the internet that this woman got an epidural, and whether or not that is a potential HIPAA violation right?
Being forced to drink raw milk all day is part of an ancient execution method designed to kill you with your own diarrhea soaking you until you rot alive.
Unfortunately, this is true but they’ll also mix it with honey and pour it on you as well. Bugs and rats will then start to eat you alive along with the bacteria. It’s called Scaphism.
The veracity of that is a bit debatable though, it’s allegedly a Persian practice and the only sources are Greek wartime propaganda intended to paint them as barbarians.