feddit.org

-9 points

6 months ago

They said same thing with Isreal and nothing will change post conference. As long as there are bad actors the disenfranchisement of American voters will continue until election day.

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7 points

6 months ago

You do realize replacing Biden post primary is by definition an act of disenfranchisement of the voters right? Literally tossing out all the votes.

This conversation is only happening because of how seriously everyone who wasn’t on the Biden Hate train already anyways actually recognizes how serious pulling that lever is, and are raising the question anyways because Biden’s recent flubs have spooked everyonethat much.

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Olgratin_Magmatoe@lemmy.world

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6 points

6 months ago

You do realize replacing Biden post primary is by definition an act of disenfranchisement of the voters right? Literally tossing out all the votes.

While I don’t completely disagree with what you’re saying here, you are far overstating the nature of the primaries. By the time my state’s primary rolled around, every single candidate dropped out and endorsed Biden. It’s not really much of a vote if there is only one guy to vote for.

The primaries are dog shit and routinely fail to present candidates that accurately reflect the will of the people. People are now calling for Biden to drop out as a result of that.

I’m still voting for Biden for now, but this shit isn’t ever going to get better until we have elections that actually capture the will of the people.

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5 points

6 months ago

They’d represent the will of the people more if the people could be assed to fucking show up to any of them.

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Olgratin_Magmatoe@lemmy.world

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2 points

6 months ago

That’s definitely a contributing factor, but not the only one. The use of FPTP voting, the spread of election days being based on which state you’re in, the inherent biases and control the establishment has over it all are IMO bigger factors.

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0 points

6 months ago

Yeah but no.

Millenials and Gen Z could have swamped the primaries easily by just showing the fuck up even at their share of the voting age population.

Let me rephrase that to help you understand the fucking abdication of civil duty young voters have perpetrated.

They are not even performing to population share never-goddamned-mind the easy overrepresenting share they could hold in primary season if they spent half the energy showing up that they do about who everyone that did chose instead of who they liked.

It’s like people think they shouldn’t have to participate to achieve their desired outcomes in a participatory democracy.

This is not a disenfranchisement problem, this is a “I don’t actually give a fuck but Imma blame dA aStAbLuShMiNt instead of owning up to the consequences of my apathy for all but my own interests” problem.

It would have been a landslide if they fucking showed up. When Bernie needed them most, they told him they had a thing that day.

Young eligible voters owe what they want the bare minimum of showing up when the time comes to be able to influence who’s calling the shots on what wants get acted on.

If the orangutan wins and plunges this country into civil war, first thing I’m gonna ask anyone who asks me for help is if they voted, and if they say no and don’t have a good reason for it, I’ll shoot them in the face for condemning me and everyone like me to hide in shelters like rats for fear of being interred because “guys just trust me the DNC is gonna learn their lesson this time I swear just trust me bro were gonna do revolution by not doing anything bro I swear bro Project 2025 is just shitlib fearmongering bro Dobbs was actually Hillary’s fault for not making me want to preserve Roe enough to wait in a line for an afternoon tops just trust me bro.”

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Olgratin_Magmatoe@lemmy.world

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0 points

6 months ago

they told him they had a thing that day.

Crazy, it’s almost like we need some sort of change so that people can reliably and easily show up. Maybe we can call it election reform or something.

That, and by the time my state got around to voting, Bernie had dropped out and endorsed Biden. Do you honestly expect young voters to vote for somebody who has explicitly told them to vote for somebody else?

Young eligible voters owe what they want the bare minimum of showing up

The solution to large scale behavioral problems isn’t condescending shouting down towards people to change their behavior. It didn’t work with cigarettes, those only fell out of use to the extent that they did after reform/regulation came down. It doesn’t work with road safety, people will always speed until the road is designed to make people feel unsafe driving faster than the posted limit. It doesn’t work with crime rates, crime will continue to exist until people’s needs are met, and that includes healthcare, shelter, food, water, a job with security, the ability to retire, etc.

The solution to large scale behavioral problems is routinely structural change. This problem is no different.

The primaries need to be legally binding so that people have confidence that their vote will be respected. They need to implement voting systems that actually give all candidates a fair chance (especially not looking at you FPTP). They need to hold the primaries on a single day that everybody gets off from work, so that everybody gets a chance to vote for all of the candidates. All campaigns need to equally spend money from a shared pool to run their campaigns so no one campaign gets a monetary advantage. The list of election reforms goes on, but the point is there is a myriad of reasons why our elections are fucking dog shit, which results in a lack of confidence, which further results in a lack of turnout.

Yelling at people to change their behavior will never work.

first thing I’m gonna ask anyone who asks me for help is if they voted, and if they say no and don’t have a good reason for it, I’ll shoot them in the face for condemning me and everyone like me

And what does it take to meet this totally not arbitrary “good reason” in order to not have violence inflicted upon somebody?

Does living in a guaranteed blue state do the trick? What about being brainwashed by your family/media? Quit being so trigger happy, it won’t do anybody any good.

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4 points

6 months ago

Biden’s recent flubs have spooked everyonethat much.

A lot of people have a short memory. Biden’s verbal gaffes were well-known during his time as Obama’s VP, not even mentioning before that. If anything, he’s gotten better at speaking.

People should be paying attention to his actions and accomplishments as President. We have the last four years to look at, and while his handling of Israel leaves a lot to be desired, he’s made great strides in the areas of workers rights, climate, student loans, and inflation.

Calling his latest gaffes anything new is just buying into propaganda. I have yet to see any legitimate criticism over his health or ability to run an administration.

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2 points

6 months ago

There’s gaffes and then there’s stumble mumbling your way through an entire debate.

It doesn’t matter if it’s all propoganda, if enough people bought it then we gotta move fast to patch the hole before the whole damn ship sinks.

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TrickDacy@lemmy.world

3 points

6 months ago

stumble mumbling your way through an entire debate

I think that’s an exaggeration. 85% of the time what he said was correct and made sense. He got flustered a few times and babbled. I ideally want a president that doesn’t do that very often, but I HATE the idea that if you misspeak then you’re incompetent. I can DO things much better than I can describe them.

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-1 points

6 months ago

Yes, most likely you can, doesn’t change that not being able to describe them well is going to make others question if you’re the right choice to be in charge.

Yeah, it’s ableist bullshit, no, calling that out on everyone who’s worrying is not gonna help.

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0 points

6 months ago

So spooked that you would let an authoritarian felon take office instead. Perfectly valid response.

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0 points

6 months ago

How the fuck is replacing the candidate that everyone’s still gonna vote for letting the authoritarian felon take office instead?

This isn’t a third party run, this isn’t punishment voting, this isn’t vote striking, this is replacing a candidate who’s performed poorly enough for members of his own party’s leadership to openly question his fitness.

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0 points

6 months ago

Right, and your focus on a pipe dream to have biden step down is really something more than a distraction from Trump and his end run for dictator.

I tell myself people like you are obviously bad actors because I cant believe any one could be so stupid to sow division this close to election day. You’re setting yourself and everyone else up for disappointment. People will walk away from the conference like they were entitled to Bernie or some shit but biden has already made his choice and short of a revelation the man won’t change his mind.

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0 points

6 months ago

Jesus Christ you’re a dense mother fucker. Yeah, and Lizz Truss said she wasn’t quitting too.

Shit can change, and pressing for this to be settled now instead of after the conference when he’s locked in as the official nominee, is the fucking definition of raising the question in good faith.

You gotta take off the tankie detector and realize more than just the far left who already hated him started asking questions after that debate, and he has not done a good job of answering them except to sound like your stubborn grandpa you practically have to strap to the chair to keep him from trying to reshingle the roof.

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1 point

6 months ago

You fucking think I want to be right. That is the exact reason we are so fucked.

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