PS.
I would for vote Kamala. I would vote for a cactus with sunglasses if it had the Democratic nomination. You would do yourself well to consider anything that is weaking the resolve of the anti-trump sentiment straight poison to your brain. We have only one job this novemeber and that is to stop trump. The Supreme Court has given him the status of king. Quit acting like your vote is sacred and start realizing your vote is your final cry before your rights are forfeited.
It’s not about that. It’s about sleep walking into fascism. Before the debate it was metaphorical. If you keep voting for the lesser evil you still get evil. It just takes longer.
Now we’re being asked to vote for someone who clearly cannot handle the duties of the office and is nothing more than a figurehead. Rubber stamping this does not protect democracy. It proves they can manufacture consent to put whoever they want in that office and you guys will keep pulling that lever thinking, “it could be worse”.
Ok so let’s have Trump instead?
No, thanks. Vote for Biden so that we don’t have to repeat the fallout of 2016.
Vote for anyone but Biden, Trump, and RFK.
We aren’t too close to November to replace him.
That’s why we’re voting for the administration, not the man. And we’re voting AGAINST Trump, not FOR Biden.
But you tell yourself whatever it is that makes you feel good about turning your back on those who’s lives are going to essentially be made illegal. Because beneath it all- knowing what’s at stake, and choosing not to vote anyway, is admitting that none of the shit you’re “concerned” about really matters.
Well they’re already being made illegal, and all of the homeless people are going to be made illegal too. Don’t be surprised when they start going into camps together, no matter whose president. Because Biden isn’t fighting for them. He’s going tooth and nail to make sure GM isn’t pressured by actual competition and to make sure Landlords can still kill you for rent. But LGBTQ rights? shit, don’t make me laugh.
At any rate my comments here are about replacing him so we have a chance. Because Biden is losing this election. The people who actually elect the president are responding to pollsters and they’re telling everyone they won’t vote for Biden. It doesn’t matter if every democrat in every other state turns out. If they don’t get the 100,000 or so undecided people in swing states, it’s over. And we have a chance to avoid that.
It’s always interesting to see what you’ll tell yourself as an excuse. Whatever makes you sleep better at night man.
The rest of us just see you not giving a shit.
You’re right, and I’m getting real sick of the “shut up and fall in line” demand from democrats.
In this current system, EVERY election now will always be “the most important one ever”, with fascism at the front door and our democracy being at stake.
When the options are between (insert every terrible adjective that accurately describes him here) Trump, and ‘guy with obvious mental decline’ Biden, the blame doesn’t lie with the voter. If Joe Biden can’t earn people’s votes, the responsibility lies with Joe Biden and the Democrat establishment.
There are millions of leftist voters in this country who are being ignored by the two parties, and the democrats are hostile toward them and don’t want to move left to gain their votes. The leftist voters then get villainized by dems for seeking out a third party that better aligns with their values. “How dare you not fall in line! A vote for a third party is a vote for Trump!” No, it’s not. It’s exercising what little democracy we have left. The only vote for trump is an actual vote for trump.
The Democrat establishment simply doesn’t offer enough to anyone left of them. I don’t want the status quo; the status quo sucks. It’s a deregulated capitalist hellscape full of cruelty, slavery, wealth inequality, and planetary disaster.
I wish the dems could step back and realize what they are advocating for. The best and only choice for president is currently an 81-year-old man dealing with cognitive decline?! No, that’s not okay! That is not acceptable!
Ah yes a figure head of the party who did all this:
https://www.reddit.com/r/WhatBidenHasDone/comments/1abyvpa/the_complete_list_what_biden_has_done/
Is just as bad as the figure head of a fascist, xenophobic, racist, authoritarian, nationalist, religious zealot party because they are both figureheads. You’re right.
I’m not even going to start with a list put together by his base. The news can’t put one together that doesn’t get ripped to shreds once you actually look at it. I doubt his base has put together anything like a list that says what the policies actually do. And no the title of the bill or the PR elevator pitch has no relation to what it actually does. For example he actually severely cut EV subsidies and you all fell on your knees to thank him for it.
Literally your best argument against this NOT ALL OF THOSE ARE REAL BECAUSE HIS SUPPORTERS COMPILED IT SO IMMA VOTE FOR A FACIST RACIST
You’re fucking wild bro
and is nothing more than a figurehead
Fine by me.
Come November, I will not be voting for an old guy named Biden. I will be voting for the Biden administration, an administration that rejoined the Paris climate accords, has made progress wrt medical debt, has seen decreasing levels of uninsured Americans, and made progress on myriad other issues. Because the alternative is…well, you know.
I am not voting for my ideal candidate, or my ideal administration, but that’s because 1) I’m not an accelerationist, and 2) I’m smart enough to know how this works given our deeply flawed voting system.
I’m not sure you can really have it both ways — the only alternatives for someone who doesn’t want Trump but won’t vote for Biden that I see are accelerationism, or complete and utter naivety…which is functionally equivalent to accelerationism.
Yes, you can manufacture consent. That was obvious. What will you do about it? The question being asked isn’t, “how do we rebuild america.” It is what do we do in novemeber. Any thing else is purposeful obsfucation.
Short term, pressure for replacing Biden. November, vote if you can stomach it. Thereafter, get involved with your state party. March. If you’re in a red state then you have a unique position of running on more progressive things that are actually people oriented. That’s what led to Democrats taking state wide offices in Arizona. You aren’t beholden to the DNC’s mega donors.
If you’re in a blue state plan to help primary an establishment Democrat.
Don’t shirk away because you can’t do it yourself, that’s an unrealistic expectation. Organize your friends, your coworkers, your commuter bus, etc.
Nothing in politics is “over” if you can get a critical mass of people to agree to change things. And it’s really the only way off this manufactured consent treadmill for corporate power and profits we’ve been on for the last 40 years.
Edit to add- Confining the question to November is a logical fallacy. We aren’t that close to the election that we can do nothing but vote. So that’s pretty much just another attempt to get people to turn their brain off, vote, and then sit around waiting for the next thing their told to do. If we don’t “activate” and start acting independently of big money then we aren’t going to have a democracy come 2028, no matter which person is elected now. Biden is a vote for an Authoritarian Oligarchy. Which isn’t “Fascism” in a technical sense, but it’s not going to feel much different for you and me.
I’m not the guy above but I like to answer that with “Giving everyone the rights and benefits white men enjoyed in the 1960’s.”
The risk of doing nothing becomes the greatest risk of all. It absolutely could be worse, we all lived through 4 years of Trump (and the aftermath re:Supreme Court appointments). We don’t need hypotheticals here, there’s a clear comparison between 4 years of Trump and 4 years of Biden, and not voting out of principal doesn’t stop anything.
In full transparency, I’m not voting for Biden in November because of the Palestinian Genocide and because I believe he’s already ineffective at protecting LGBTQ rights in red states. But I’m not here to tell you not to vote for him in November. I should have been more clear above. We have the momentum to replace him and vote for someone that isn’t just a figurehead. Biden and his allies are using the “vote blue no matter who” rhetoric as a club to stop people from talking about replacing him on the ticket. We can cross that bridge on August 23rd though, the day after the convention. Right now we need to fully and faithfully have the conversation about replacing him.
After November we need to better organize to prevent the mega donor class from steering us into a full Oligarchy. Something that’s on the plate for both old guys.
I hate to break it to you but if it’s Biden & Trump in November, regarding Palestinian Genocide and LGBTQ rights, Trump will absolutely be worse than Biden, so not voting for Biden will not change anything and just make things worse.
nothing more than a figurehead.
That figurehead happens to be surrounded by people who aren’t fascists and support policy that I mostly agree with, so I guess I’ll take my chances with them.
Sure, if you agree with the policies of the Oligarchy then who am I to stop you?
You’re already retired though right? Because if you aren’t then I wouldn’t plan on them allowing you to ever do so.
The problem with this meme is that it’s written by a shelter middle class white person. Minorities and poor people HAVE been dying due to Democrats’ capitation and appeasement to Republicans for years now.
So… to summarize, conservatives are killing people, the democrats AREN’T killing people, but not doing enough to stop the people from being killed, sooooooo….
It’s best to just not try and stop the conservatives from killing more people?
Do I have that right?
the democrats AREN’T killing people, but not doing enough to stop the people from being killed
Biden is actively aiding and abetting the genocide by sending munitions and tens of billions of dollars of war funding to Israel, and using America’s UN security council veto to prevent the UN from acting.
Sigh…. Again-
Trump will do FAR worse. You know this. Everyone knows this. Biden is trying to put the brakes on things there and being diplomatic with Israel is not the easiest thing to do. You know damn well that if he tried to stop it, congress wouldn’t just block that from happening.
You people don’t ever seem to understand how politics work. You think knits just so easy to simply stop doing something.
Donnie “finish the job” Trump WANTS to support Israel. And if you get your way, he’s going to-
So stop with the bleeding heart bullshit. I’m not buying it. If you cared, you do whatever it takes to keep Trump from winning the White House.
Youre missing that those are literallynthe only two options that are available, and changing that is politically impossible
Oh I’m not missng anything. What I’m seeing is a lot of people that don’t under how shit works.
Huh? Candance Owens downplays minorities’ struggles, much like Democrat toadies like yourself.
Except your are parroting her rhetoric… so I guess you’re down playing minority struggles.
You’re right, minorities and poor people have suffered and some died while Democrats were ostensibly in charge. What do you propose an American does on election day?
Barring a cataclysmic reordering of American politics, it’s still true that voting for anyone but the Democratic candidate will increase the odds of Trump winning. Trump is a blatant liar, corrupt, rapist, and racist. He’s promised to enact revenge on those he perceives as his enemies, and his proposed policies will cause suffering an order of magnitude more than what is already unjustly inflicted on minorities and the poor.
It sucks. We should have good candidates to choose from. We should have ranked choice voting and a multi-party system, but we don’t.
It’s inflicting harm on yourself and many others to do anything other than vote Democrat in November. There’s more we can do than vote, but that’s a bare minimum.
That’s extremely simplistic. The complicated truth is:
- It’s a law of political science (Duverger’s specifically) that a first-past-the-post system leads large, mass-appeal parties, and parties that don’t go for mass appeal will fail.
- In the US, the political balance is further pushed to the right by a) unequal representation that typically favors rural states and districts, most egregiously in the Senate, and b) denial of representation to particularly blue parts of the country like PR and DC. This means that relative to the country, Democrats cannot be as far left as Republicans are far right and still hold power. This can be observed in the simple fact that in the 21st century, Democrats have won 5/6 national popular votes, but have only controlled the Senate in 4/12 sessions.
- From 1 and 2, it follows that Democrats would effectively lose what little political power they have by taking a firm leftist stance, leading to effectively a one-party far right state.
How can you discuss the flaws of First past the post and NOT want to change the voting system?
genocide is not really meh
Of course not. But in the American implementation of FPTP, even more so than somewhere like the UK, you must pick the lesser of two weavels.
Context. We are talking about a US presidential candidate.
Because of the military industrial complex there are only two types of US presidential candidates.
Ones who have contributed to some form of genocide around the world
And
Ones who have yet to contribute to some form of genocide around the world
this is exactly what makes it not meh, any other country would be a brutal militaristic dictatorship.
See the “other country” part of your response. That’s where context comes in.
You’re right, in the most basic, duh, observational type way, the US Government is toxic to the core.
If that’s validating to you, and you think we need to linger on it, you’re not really ready for the discussion you are currently taking part of.
I’d like to go back in time and live there with you, with all my heart. I really can’t though. So, please stay where you’re at. When this goes up, fork in electrical socket sytle, we will need you.
Biden’s position on Israel/Gaza isn’t good, but it’s entirely expected. Israel is the only real US ally in the Middle East, which means the US is going to side with Israel pretty much regardless of what Israel does for strategic reasons if nothing else. The odds we’d do anything more severe than asking nicely if they’d maybe tone it down a bit while still giving them everything they want is functionally zero.
And that’s not really going to change regardless of who is president.
so genocide doesn’t matter in the face of losing their tight grip hegemony over the middle east. isn’t good is a bit of an understatement. i dont think this is a fair justification for what the us does around the world.
It’s not, but it’s also not something you’re going to change by voting for Biden, Trump, some candidate with no chance of winning or no one at all. Because every road leads to the US continuing to support Israel.
100% is not going to be yelled at into voting for Biden.
But if you just shame them harder, or maybe tell them Democracy is even MORE on the line than ever ever, pinky promise (sorry we played this card then we didn’t even bother to prosecute the guy who put democracy on the line right before the election and whoopsie it went all fucky wucky and the clock ran out).
There is a culture of trolling and abuse that has been allowed to foment on lemmy where the only acceptable view is effectively a form of diet-facism that comes from within the culture around the DNC, where questioning the decisions and strategies of people who are objectively bad at winning elections is simply disallowed.
This thing’s over with Biden as candidate, and BNMW earned the L.
I’m not the one who put in Biden you dip shit. I primaried against him in 2020, was vocally against him in 2021, 2022, and 2023.
You fucking wish that a biden win is impossible. You are the trumper and the fascist and everything that goes with it because effectively, everything you do is for him.
lol you say you were against Biden until 2023? And now you’re this? Congratulations, you stand for absolutely nothing.
I hope Biden wins. And then I want him to go to The Hague. Y’all gotta quit pretending that Biden is the only thing saving your country from fascism. It’s an embarrassment.
You’re the embarrassment. Ushering in fascism and pretending you’re better than anyone. People dead in the streets you’ll sit at home drinking your own piss thinking, “I sure told that guy online once.”
“Blue MAGAs” “It’s over. You lost”
This troll has no intention of having a meaningful discussion. He lives in a bizarre reality where voting against a rapist, dictator, and felon is the same as going full cock in hand for an authoritarian. Block him and move on.
“Blue MAGA” What fucking fascist circlejerk birthed that nonsense?
The term has been around for just over a year.
AKA Blue Fash/ Blue MAGA/ BNMW (But actually only Biden).
It started as a descriptor for those defending Biden running again (when it was a literal campaign promise that he would stick to one term). Got more traction when the DNC cancelled/ disallowed any debates that would have put Biden on stage and have him challenged from within the party. The DNC pushed for a coronation and fed the line that anyone challenging this was “for Trump” through their various mainstream and alternative outlets.
Dummies ate it up, and post October, say, November, when it was clear that Biden was taking the wrong side of the Gaza/ Israel issue and he started to see challenges to his policies from within the party, thats when the Blue MAGA rhetoric really got going. Its rhetorically very similar to what we saw coming from r/TheDonald in the earliest days of the MAGA movement. No space for nuance, gaslit trolling, vote-shaming, etc.
When we saw a write in campaign for Undecided, that should have been the “SLAM ON BREAKS/ PULL HANDLE TO STOP” moment for Joe Biden, but Blue MAGA, in both mainstream and social media, worked to prevent a serious discussion around Joe Biden until very recently, when it became so appealingly glaring that he couldn’t win, even their abuse wasn’t enough to halt the conversation.
“I don’t know why you get up in the morning, you’re just gonna die eventually anyway”
- bad_news (probably)
Easier just to block some folks.
Yep, democrats will do anything but appeal to the voters they actually need. Hillary didn’t campaign in Michigan and spent a fortune in campaign money in Texas, but they’re still blaming her loss on Jill Stein (as if people that would rather vote third party in a swing state would switch to the democrats if only you yelled at them enough).
Biden lost critical swing state Muslims, a swathe of Gen Z and there’s probably a bunch of independents that do care about the age issue and also don’t see the “great economy” Biden keeps talking about.
Biden does one thing wrong. And that is Gaza. There is a shit ton he has done right:
Supreme Court reform
Student loan debt relief
Healthcare reform
Renewable energy act
Banking reform
Agriculture subsidies to be ecological
Helping local farms
Weed restriction reclassification
Tech privacy restrictions
Making medicare more accessible
Veteran affairs
And quite a few more. Give credit where credit is due. He’s worked hard for us.
Sanctioning and providing material support for a genocide is not in the same category as any of these things.
Sanctioning and providing material support for a genocide is not in the same category as any of these things.
Why pick that and why pick that now, this time? Why not before? Why not other genocides? Is it because you look good in a keffiyeh?
Supreme Court reform? Did Clarence get the boot without anyone noticing? Are there more than 9 now?
I think it was yesterday he filed for term limits? As well as an ethics code? It’s still early. But it’s a step in the right direction.
A toothless, self imposed ethics code, and he sat on term limits for 3 years
