It pisses me off to no end when people conflate legitimate criticism of Democrats with tankie rhetoric. The Dems are complacent, listless, corrupt, and lazy. They refuse to stand up to the Republicans until it’s too late or doesn’t matter.
The people want progressive politics: universal healthcare, living wage, affordable housing, education, and food. We want a sustainable future and an end to corporate greed.
The donor class, superpacs, and other sources of dark money in politics are what keep nearly everyone corrupt. Its addictive.
It pisses me off to no end when people conflate legitimate criticism of Democrats with tankie rhetoric.
Last election season went something like this:
Progressives: “Please stop sending weapons to a genocidal maniac who is using them to murder children in order to grab land. And stop actively protecting said genocidal maniac from consequences in the international community.”
Establisment: “STFU tankie!”
Completely wrong, Tankies weren’t just promoting primarying Biden, a pretty obvious lost cause from the start given his incumbent status, they were promoting voting against Biden in the generals. That is NOT advocacy against genocide in Gaza. Trump is a single-state supporter.
Except that there are 2 groups: progressives and a more extreme left group. Progressives who were arguing in good faith against genocide were lumped in with the latter group.
The establishment Democrats were engaging in censorship and suppression of anything that was critical of Israel. Now Trump has stepped up this censorship/suppression, but it was definitely happening under Biden.
Maybe if progressives in partisan primary states registered as Democrats and voted in the primaries, they wouldn’t be complaining about all the centrists in office.🤔
Are you implying there was a Democratic presedential primary that didn’t break it’s own rules to make sure Biden was the only candidate on the ballot (edit) in many states (/edit)?
If so, you’re living in a fantasy.
This is the one-two step for Democratic party apologists.
-
Blame leftists for their lack of representation in the party.
-
Rig the processes to make sure that the left wing of the party has no internal representation.
-
Goto step one.
The best part of this dance from their view? Internal party politics and processes are boring, and the media won’t cover it when they cheat.
So you’re ok with centrists supporting and actively protecting perpetrators of genocide?
What primary? The DNC shut down real primaries last election. To the point where undecided was the protest vote.
A race between Biden, Williamson, and Phillips isn’t a real primary.
A real primary would have been something like Biden, Newsom, Whitmer, and maybe Shapiro.
There is no point voting in a rigged primary.
Accountability is one think these people will not take. Has me questioning where they get off calling themselves progressive. They can’t even handle the mere suggestion which is evident by the number of downvotes that occurs when it’s mentioned.
Are you trying to say we can’t have universal healthcare without leftist authoritarianism or do you not know what a “tankie” is?
That’s cause “tankie” is right wing propaganda for exactly that reason. It blunts progressive discourse dead in its tracks.
What’s worse is that sometimes I can’t tell if it’s Right Wing trolls or truly insane hard leftists.
I consider myself hard left progressive, but I have caveats like anyone. Tankies are so cartoonish, I don’t know how to react.
Yeah you’ll never know for sure. Actual tankies are what like a small subset of the small percent of progressives. Fractions of a fraction. Statistically they are non-existent. There is an outsized presense online. So one could reason that most of them you encounter are acting in bad faith. It’s been a very effective weapon on information warfare.
My philosophy is to abide by the oldest rule of the internet. Don’t feed the trolls.
and yet they are head and shoulders above the trump cult
anyone that can’t see that or chooses to campaign and vote against the democrats is so corrupted by socialist fundamentalism that they enabled fascism
So when they agree to vote for Trump’s demands, they’re fundamentally better? Gutting Section 230 is the better choice because Trump said it, but they voted for it? Appointing Trump’s batshit cabinet picks? Bombs are inherently less deadly if a D signed off on it instead of a R?
Is my governor, Newsom of California, inherently better for being a democrat as he invites Republicans like actual open nazi and helper of Trump’s rise to power, Steven Bannon? Is he inherently better when he agrees with Charlie Kirk that trans people don’t have a place in society? Giving them not just a soap box, but a microphone and a speaker to the masses, and agreeing with them?
This is better? Agreeing to their demands and pretending you’re not helping their fascism?
you couldn’t see the difference before the election and you still can’t see the difference now?
for real?
come ooooon
at least talk about bernie and aoc or something vaguely convincing
I’m just punching right. Tell the Dems to stop standing there.
And it was the Dems who sued the socialist candidate off of the ballot in my state. Not the GOP. They occupy leftist space to prevent leftward movement, while Dems ally with the GOP to push through fascism.
Yep, generalizations work across the board. /s
Bernie and AOC are democrats. The Republicans and Democrats, although I could understand arguments against this, are humans. They can be greedy, shitty, liars, awesome, for the people and and for the oligarchs.
I’m always a little suspect when someone in the face of the r’s having convicted rapists, some of them pedos, on their platform, taking away constitutional rights, and tanking the stock market, say the left is too right. Are they? Some, but let’s focus on putting out the fire, not the dumpsters paint job.
I don’t really know what to do with this comment.
I don’t know who you think the left is, or what actions you associate with putting out the fire.
I believe that the Democratic party leadership is extremely hostile to socialist policies, despite their enormous populist electoral power. Universal healthcare is good policy and good politics. So are jobs guarantees and basic minimum incomes and paid sick leave and free college. I have found that most Democrats who have the power to decide whether they would like voters to associate them with these policies or would like to avoid being associated with them choose the later.
I’ll vote for the lesser of two evils, because I’m a highly educated supervoter news junkie. But ultimately what costs Democrats their power was not the criticism and anger I and people like me posted online: it was ignoring that criticism when we were warning them that they were running unpopular candidates on unpopular platforms.
As far as I’m aware, conversations like this one are not hindering the good guys. What’s hindering the good guys is their choices and lack of integrity. The reason people like Chuck Schumer can’t stop Trump is not because I point out that he’s incapable of stopping Trump. It’s the other way around. I point that out because despite all efforts on the part of people like me, Chuck Schumer is unable to decide to stop Trump. That’s an internal problem and most critics of Democrats – which now includes most Democratic voters – are just spectators pointing to this problem.
Bernie & AOC are center right at best. They’re both still feverishly advocating for sending more arms to extremists in Europe and the Middle East.
I’m not sure you’ve even seen the left, based on this comment.
“Tankies” made no measurable difference in the 2024 election. There’s next to none of them in the USA. Go ahead: ask real people in your offline life what a tankie is, and see if even one single person has even heard that word.
Unless, of course, you’re just applying that word to anyone whos not a Republican that’s criticizing the dems. Then I suppose you’ll find “tankies” everywhere.
It feels like a word that’s just being used to divide the left.
It’s the lib version of “woke”; it’s not even used for its original meaning anymore
“All the tankie college kids who love Hamas lost Kamala the election” ok Kristen I’m sure they’re tankies. Please just finish watching your DVR of the Today show
Thank you for clarifying, because I was confused. Like… ‘Are the Tankies in the room with us now, OP?’
What you’re saying sounds correct, because I don’t know anyone to the left of Harris who didn’t recognize that Trump was worse. While I think that I might have one friend who refused to vote for her in a swing state, I think that the BlueAnon folks really misunderstood the actual consequences of losing support on the left.
It wasn’t really, imo, that those folks wouldn’t show up. The problem was that I think a lot of folks never realized how much young blue-haired leftists dragged Biden across the finish line in 2020 by knocking on doors and convincing their uncles to vote Dem. I said throughout the election that losing those people wasn’t really a risk of losing their votes, it was a risk of losing the core enthusiasm and turnout organizing that Democrats had largely outsourced to Bernie Sanders’ base. And I could be wrong, but all that I’ve seen seems to affirm that this is exactly what happened.
If someone has evidence otherwise, though. please let me know.
What you’re saying sounds correct, because I don’t know anyone to the left of Harris who didn’t recognize that Trump was worse. While I think that I might have one friend who refused to vote for her in a swing state, I think that the BlueAnon folks really misunderstood the actual consequences of losing support on the left.
I do find it funny that .world and their ilk will swear up and down that Blue MAGA and BlueAnon aren’t real things, but then will swear Tankies are a thing non-stop in American politics when none of them can agree on what they look like or do.
You ask a Republican to define woke, you wont get an answer beyond “Anything I don’t like to the left of me.” You ask a Democrat on here to define Tankie, you won’t get an answer beyond “Anything I don’t like to the left of me.”
So long as the person doesn’t defend authoritarianism and any hypocrisy of their preferred candidate, I’ll consider them an ally to me.
Tankies aren’t left, the word means exactly what it has always meant: supporters of Russian and Chinese Dictatorships. People who would side with the Tanks in their respective massacres of civilians.
I really wish we lived in a world where psyops and social media made no difference in elections.
If it’s “always meant supporting Russia” but the term was coined when Russia was run by the communist party and part of the USSR? Do you not think the communist that supported Russia “the Tankies” would be against the capitalist Oligarchy that Russia currently is?
You’re just using a term to mean what you want it to. Definitely not what it’s “always meant”.
-
Lemmygrad, ML, and Hexbear Tankies support all three with no distinctions.
-
Economically Russia has transformed structurally it has not. More specifically it has regressed due to Putin ignoring term limits and empowering a loyal Oligarchy. Putin has even said publicly that he wants to restore the former Russian Empire.
There are definitely tactics being used to divide the left and the word tankie is not one of them. Purity politics is the death of left wing politics. The fact that people moved out of the way of blocking a legitimate facist government because Harris wasn’t quiiite right is utter insanity
There are definitely tactics being used to divide the left and the word tankie is not one of them. Purity politics is the death of left wing politics.
Why, then, are we running around calling people tankies when that is an ill-defined word that tends to change from person to person? I’ve seen it applied to everyone from left anarchists to starry-eyed idealists who call themselves communists, to actual Stalin-Did-Nothing-Wrong types (this last group deserves criticism, all twelve of them).
The fact that people moved out of the way of blocking a legitimate facist government because Harris wasn’t quiiite right is utter insanity
Focusing on an incredibly online, vocal minority is insanity, especially when your previous statement is about purity politics.
Shouldn’t you question why Harris and the democratic establishment couldn’t beat actual fascism? Could it be that Trump used real issues in our political environment for his messaging? He lies constantly about why the cost of living is going up, why good jobs aren’t here anymore, etc, but Harris ran on a platform of “Vote for me, nothing will fundamentally change” and voters didn’t find that attractive for some reason.
Even when voices within the party point out problems they are shouted down. Sure, Bernie is an independant, but he’s been voting with the Dems the entire time, and they even pretended to let him run for nomination for president.
The democratic party has been shifting right for decades, and the only messaging they have to offer is that approved by their donors. It’s bullshit and it repels people.
So you’re just gonna sit there and act like propaganda influence on voters is not a thing
“Oh why could harris not beat fascists why did trump win i guess she just suuucked” is the awareness level of a potato
What a stupid post. Yeah it’s progressives’ fault mango Mussolini is POTUS /s. This is a talking point manufactured by MAGA handlers that some broadly Dem-supporting people choose to broadcast, now outside the US. This is a type of brainrot that undermines critical thinking, divides the left, and helps elect the right. Canada deserves better
And progressives are not leftists, they are centrist liberals. Sanders is never going to call abolishing private ownership of the means of production.
Left is Progress, Right is Conservation of old ways (Conservative)
Tankies are not Leftists, even
Trump is progressive by that logic because he is dismantling the old ways.
helps elect the right
Trump, the farthest right viable candidate, was elected because he got the most votes.
Regardless of your feelings about her, Kamala was the most viable opposition to Trump.
Some people were most active being anti-Kamala.
In your opinion, did the anti-Kamala influencers hurt Trump’s election, or did they help Trump’s election?
Kamala was the most viable opposition to Trump.
You really believe that, huh?
At the moment, yes. I’m also frequently wrong, there’s too much information in the world for me to process it all, so that’s the best conclusion I can make with the information I have.
If you can make an argument for anyone else being a more viable candidate against Trump, then give it to me.
This is bullshit though, please actually explain how Kamala is the most viable opposition to Trump? Trump is far right, and Kamala is a centrist conservative. America is further right than you think it is, Kamala is in no way shape or form an opposition.
Kamala is right wing. Trump is further right wing, guess who is gonna win?
You mentioned opposition, then where is your opposition party? Trump is a by product, you just explained how you get fascism.
“Both parties are the same” is muddying the waters in ways that always benefits the fascists.
Anti- Biden/Kamala influencers helped elect Trump. The biggest of those influencers were the mainstream media. The double standard of reporting (Biden/Harris vs Trump) is very well documented. (And the ring-kissing is approaching authoritarian levels now.) Ideas that actual grassroots would-be Democrat voters sabotaged the the Democrats’ success in the election is much less certain, but perhaps a more attractive version of reality than the big-money-funded pro right-wing system we’re up against. Less in-fighting amongst the left please
Progressives are separate from tankies. You can have leftist ideals without supporting authoritarians.
You must understand that under first-past-the-post the party that receives the most criticism tends to lose. It’s much easier to pressure democrats into doing the right thing then with republicans.
There was a lot of pressure for the most banal, milquetoast, form of representation ever in the form of having a Palestinian speaker at the Democratic national convention with a vetted speech that involved nothing that would have criticized Israel at all.
Even that was too far.
Either the progressives are powerful enough that you have to take them seriously and give them concessions, or they aren’t and you get to ignore them.
What you don’t get to do is give them nothing and blame them when you lose. Or, I guess you do if you’d prefer to lose the general over letting a progressive win the primary.
Huh, funny that, who knew there is a lot of levers and controls that a primary winner, even one that lost the general, gets.
No one calls themselves a tankie. It is a pejorative term for a progressive. It is used to silence legitimate criticism and helps right-shift politics
(Edit: I think your frustration is really more with the mainstream media and what news they choose to cover and amplify)
It’s the term that describes those communists who cheered on the Soviet Union’s violent crushing of the 1956 Hungary revolution protests.
The term is often used when someone claims they support leftist ideals but pushes for authoritarianism.
Tankie is in no way a pejorative for Progressive. Hell progressives are usually the ones using it. I wouldn’t even say tankies pretend to be Progressive.
It’s pretty easy to identify tankies. Here, I’ll draw some out for you:
Mao and Stalin were just as evil as Hitler. China is engaging in a genocide of the Uyghur people. Putin is a genocidal war criminal fighting a war of imperialism.
The difference is we don’t expect anything good from Republicans. We expect libs to at least try but they’d rather punch left than effectively govern.
What do you mean by that? What goes both ways? If you’re suggesting that Republicans will attack other Republicans, that’s not what we saw in the presidential race. Maybe if we rewind to 1992, why not.
