Nato members have pledged their support for an “irreversible path” to future membership for Ukraine, as well as more aid.

While a formal timeline for it to join the military alliance was not agreed at a summit in Washington DC, the military alliance’s 32 members said they had “unwavering” support for Ukraine’s war effort.

Nato has also announced further integration with Ukraine’s military and members have committed €40bn ($43.3bn, £33.7bn) in aid in the next year, including F-16 fighter jets and air defence support.

The bloc’s Secretary-General Jens Stoltenberg said: “Support to Ukraine is not charity - it is in our own security interest.”

You are viewing a single thread.
View all comments View context
-52 points
*

America bad is literally the reason why countries don’t want NATO on their border. You don’t get to ignore that key point and pretend OP was arguing in bad faith.

America invades countries to overthrow their government steal their natural resources. Lybia, Afghanistan, Iraq, even the Genocide in Gaza is made possible by NATO countries doing the weapons logistics.

permalink
report
parent
reply
34 points
*

Sorry, but as Eastern European, we begged for NATO membership because of constant (>200 years) Russian occupation hazard. We only care about America as a strong ally (of many) in the NATO group, there is no imperialism, direct, indirect, effective or otherwise interprettable. It’s a purely defensive pact with all its tenets clearly and publicly laid out.

We could not fight back alone and we wouldnt be able to, because just as to Ukraine and as to Nazis, the amount of meat Russia (yes the whole country, not just Putin) is willing to throw into the meatgrinder is incomprehensible.

permalink
report
parent
reply
-43 points
*

Russia might still have invaded without NATO provocation. However while Russia is evil, they do have a very valid point in not wanting NATO next to their border.

Especially since Russia’s NATO application got rejected.

permalink
report
parent
reply
28 points

Ukraine not joining NATO

Russia invade Ukraine

NATO now very open to Ukraine joining due to a Russian threat.

See how Russia is causing the NATO membership? Not preventing it.

To me it feels like Russia saying they’re invading due to NATO is just a smokescreen for something else, and a way to get support from their population.

And as it’s caused the NATO membership, Russians can now say “see! We told you so! They are joining just like we said!”, ignoring that they’ve directly caused this outcome.

I wonder if the main reason for this is just to try and better secure the black sea for some reason.

permalink
report
parent
reply
16 points

Also, these sorts don’t seem to realize that NATO is on Russia’s border regardless of Ukraine’s status. Even before Russia invaded and Finland joined NATO.

They’ve never looked at a fucking map.

permalink
report
parent
reply
11 points

I mean… When they’re claiming russia applied to NATO and was rejected… What did you expect, a sound and reasonable mind? They’re literally just repeating their propaganda, nothing more.

permalink
report
parent
reply
8 points

Also with modern power projection…we don’t have to be on your border…

permalink
report
parent
reply
3 points
Removed by mod
permalink
report
parent
reply
26 points

America bad is literally the reason why countries don’t want NATO on their border

Well, so far the only country really throwing a shit fit about having NATO on their border is Russia, probably because NATO membership gets in the way of his neo-USSR expansion plans. Don’t use a plural where it doesn’t belong.

permalink
report
parent
reply
-26 points
*

I recall Afghanistan having a NATO problem within their borders. And Lybia. And Iraq. And many other countries.

Despite all the marketing NATO is not a defensive alliance. It is an offensive one in actions.

permalink
report
parent
reply
13 points
*

I also recall Afghanistan having a Russia problem inside their borders. A very large Russia problem that Russia lost. Also NATO didnt even start that, the US did, and was the primary driver of all Afghanistan actions, and then drug some part of NATO into it (which is a separate problem) after the fact. Your point?

permalink
report
parent
reply
36 points

And yet Russia has multiple borders with NATO countries. “Your opinion” is parroting kremlin propaganda about “the nuclear end” that “will totally happen you guys” and can be summarized by “let’s give Russia everything they want, because they have nukes so they can now rule everyone”

permalink
report
parent
reply
-33 points
*

I really don’t care enough about Russia to defend their actions any further but if you look on a map you see Ukraine does not just encircle Russia but actually sticks inwards quite a bit.

And Russia did start getting more imperialist the closer NATO came.

permalink
report
parent
reply
25 points

Ah yes the closer NATO came, since before they had east Germany, Poland and other countries.

Dude. Think about what you are saying or read up more. You are repeating russian propaganda and nothing else. This is a land grab invasion. NATO doesn’t have shit to do with it otherwise Russia wouldn’t grab all their troops on NATO borders and move them to Ukraine. They know NATO isn’t an offensive alliance and are using that, then telling people like you bullshit about NATO encroachment, novorossia or other idiotic ramblings.

permalink
report
parent
reply
11 points

What? None of that would have been different without NATO. Iraq did not even involve NATO at all

permalink
report
parent
reply
-18 points
*

Oof https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/topics_88247.htm

The participation in the invasion was also NATO participants. Same with the Genocide in Gaza right now where NATO countries are doing the military logistics to provide israel with bombs and tank shells to blow up Palestinian kids.

Either directly or indirectly NATO is just an extension of whatever imperialist escapades we go on. And the few times people actually need it it’s utterly worthless such as Srebrenica and NATO just lets a Genocide happen without doing anything.

permalink
report
parent
reply
0 points

You can have independent operations by members states. If a couple of my cousins and myself go and murder someone that doesnt mean it was done by my clan. It just means some people in my clan are murderers, most alliance networks allow independent operations and actions seperate from the alliance.

permalink
report
parent
reply

World News

!world@lemmy.world

Create post

A community for discussing events around the World

Rules:

  • Rule 1: posts have the following requirements:

    • Post news articles only
    • Video links are NOT articles and will be removed.
    • Title must match the article headline
    • Not United States Internal News
    • Recent (Past 30 Days)
    • Screenshots/links to other social media sites (Twitter/X/Facebook/Youtube/reddit, etc.) are explicitly forbidden, as are link shorteners.
  • Rule 2: Do not copy the entire article into your post. The key points in 1-2 paragraphs is allowed (even encouraged!), but large segments of articles posted in the body will result in the post being removed. If you have to stop and think “Is this fair use?”, it probably isn’t. Archive links, especially the ones created on link submission, are absolutely allowed but those that avoid paywalls are not.

  • Rule 3: Opinions articles, or Articles based on misinformation/propaganda may be removed. Sources that have a Low or Very Low factual reporting rating or MBFC Credibility Rating may be removed.

  • Rule 4: Posts or comments that are homophobic, transphobic, racist, sexist, anti-religious, or ableist will be removed. “Ironic” prejudice is just prejudiced.

  • Posts and comments must abide by the lemmy.world terms of service UPDATED AS OF 10/19

  • Rule 5: Keep it civil. It’s OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It’s NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.

Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to “Mom! He’s bugging me!” and “I’m not touching you!” Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.

  • Rule 6: Memes, spam, other low effort posting, reposts, misinformation, advocating violence, off-topic, trolling, offensive, regarding the moderators or meta in content may be removed at any time.

  • Rule 7: We didn’t USED to need a rule about how many posts one could make in a day, then someone posted NINETEEN articles in a single day. Not comments, FULL ARTICLES. If you’re posting more than say, 10 or so, consider going outside and touching grass. We reserve the right to limit over-posting so a single user does not dominate the front page.

We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.

All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.


Lemmy World Partners

News !news@lemmy.world

Politics !politics@lemmy.world

World Politics !globalpolitics@lemmy.world


Recommendations

For Firefox users, there is media bias / propaganda / fact check plugin.

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/media-bias-fact-check/

Community stats

  • 10K

    Monthly active users

  • 8.8K

    Posts

  • 99K

    Comments