Comment by UltraGiGaGigantic@lemmy.ml on Guns

You would have thought that after January 6th/George Floydd protests, and the lack of justice that followed both, would have finally shown liberals they cannot rely on cops and the “justice” system for personal protection.

Yet here we are.

My body, my choice to protect it the way i wish. Fuck off gun grabbers. Prisoners are forced to give up all their rights and yet they are still not safe in prison. I refuse to be your prisoner.

SocialistRA.org

I choose to protect my body by you not having guns.

Edit: I don’t, but I think you can see the error in your argument now.

I’m sure this sounded convincing in your head.

It’s the entire argument in a nutshell yes. A common-sense response to those desires is what separates the countries that don’t have much gun crime from yours.

Countries that “don’t have much gun crime” = countries with acid attacks

This made me laugh. You sound like Philomena Cunk!

Surely, all that needs to happen is that everyone needs to carry bottles of acid. It will be completely safe in the hands of well-trained acid handlers, and accidents will only happen to people who weren’t trained well enough! This means you wouldn’t even need to regulate it!

How about you just give them guns so they can shoot the acid attackers. Turns out, you don’t need much training with a gun. Point shoot. Very simple. Point shoot. School shooters figure it out just fine.

There are all kinds of discussions we can have about this, not the least of which is that “no guns” simply isn’t an option in a country with 500 million firearms and no central firearm registry.

But, really, all that stuff is beside the point. Guns are the ultimate equalizer. They equalize the weak and the strong. An 80 year old grandma can defend herself against a 25 year old man using a gun. A suppressed populace can defend themselves against a tyrannical government using guns.

Gun crime has negligible impact on most Americans; we have about half as many firearm homicides as traffic deaths annually.

Philosophically, the gun community feels having that equalizer and balance against tyranny is more important than the impacts of gun crime. Whether or not more gun control will decrease gun crime is irrelevant if a person feels that free firearm access is the more important of the two issues.

Btw, regardless of your views, if you come to the US you should shoot some guns. It’s fun and you’ll be glad you did.

Wow, so we have too many guns so no reason to regulate has to be one of the stupidest arguments I have ever heard. It is like common sense showed up to have you shart in their face

Guns are the ultimate equalizer sounds like something a weak assed little Nazi would say. Why does every other modern civilized country not need them then? It is like you look at the worst case and say it is now the best case

I could give a shit about the feels of gun nutters. To think we have to appease homicidal radicals is fucking bonkers.

I think most people will pass on the shooting thing. There is a lot more to the USA than a bunch of gun waving lunatics.

We have not only more guns in circulation than people, but a constitutional right to those guns that you would have to overcome to remove them all.

I never expected to see a “those who disagree with me are actual Nazis” in the wild, used apparently straight faced. Godwin’s law kicked in very quickly.

I have traveled most of the country and 95% of Americans are normal people who just want the best for the people around them. They just have different perspectives on what that means.

You should let your hate go, my friend. I promise you’ll be happier for it.

The working class must remain armed.

preach! This! couldn’t have said it better myself.

these people are such idiots. besides, the founding fathers didn’t exclusively intend the second amendment to be used against petty thieves or violent criminals… they wanted it to be used to resist tyranny in all its forms. One form of tyranny is prosecutors dropping violent felons cases, judges setting low bail on repeat violent offenders, and federal governments throwing the borders open and granting special protection to violent criminals that come across the border. The government at best can punish crime, but it can never defend us. I am more than willing to accept school shootings if it means I can shoot someone that I deem a threat if necessary.

You are seriously arguing that the corruption in our police system means there is no protection? This is objectively false.

I would trust an officer over Ultragagginggunnut any day of the week.

The only prisoners are our school children who have to drill for gun violence in their school. Kids who live in fear that their classmates will kill them because they brought another gun nutters unsecured gun to school.

The prisoners are the wives and partners of every abusive gun owner. Scared to leave because they know that it could cost their lives. You ever been raped at gun point? Yeah, didn’t think so.

The prisoners are our society that has to deal with the commercialization of gun ownership and the radicalization of the NRA. Everyday they make our society more unsafe in the name of profits.

The problem isn’t guns, it is people like you that think they solve problems. Guns create problems not solve them.

They need to be tightly controlled to keep them away from people who are mentally unwell. People that think they are the “prisoners” fantasizing about defending their rights and overthrowing the government.

I know you got downvoted, but in other countries and anywhere other than lemmy, the US and truth social, this is actually normal

It’s crazy that extremist groups like the NRA have managed to brainwash so many Americans

Oh I know what I was getting into by commenting on their post. I will gladly take downvotes from gun nutters.

I appreciate what you say though because in the US it seems easy to question your sanity at times.

Yep… Whats crazy, is that literally a few months ago, everyone was pointing out how weird the nutters on the right wing are. And how rediculous the gun nuts are

Now, somehow, there seems to have been some kind of concerted campaign that have made a lot of these people start to act exactly like the extreme right, where shooting seemingly anyone you don’t like is apparently “ok”. But at least a lot of those guys tied them to random conspiracy theories, whereas, what I’m seeing suddenly by some people on the left, is basically just blatant wanting to kill certain people

[Attenborough voice]

“And here we see a wild false equivalency in it’s natural habitat. Camouflaged and perfectly suited to it’s environment, it goes unnoticed by many”

“Some humans have started recording the mating calls of this and other closely related cousins in the misinformationum ridiculosus family in hope of harnessing the power of the sounds for themselves, results have been varied”

Yeah, I cringe whenever I hear about the murderous left. Propaganda is one hell of a drug.

Well gun supporters have been at war with the truth for a long time. People I call gun nutters have an unhealthy obsession with guns. They keep them unsecured and loaded and like to fantasize about killing people in “self defense”.

America’s obsession with guns definitely cuts both ways but when you compare the left and right wing 95% of attacks come from the right. It is an unfortunate reality but the people who we can least trust are the ones who are the most for guns.

Really though this is a problem of regulation. Commercial interests have manipulated people into buying tools they don’t need which are misused and cause untold suffering.

All of your responses are being downvoted and for good reason. Maybe you need to rethink some things

Rethink that you are another gun apologist? Hard pass on that goober.

In other countries this is normal. Including here in Australia

Maybe you need to rethink some things and get some perspective from countries where we don’t have regular mass shootings. Our kids don’t need to do training for school shootings

What you’re doing clearly isn’t working

That’s also why we didn’t get people trying to overthrow our Capitol

It’s absolutely ridiculous at this point for an American to be giving any advice about guns

I would trust an officer over Ultragagginggunnut any day of the week.

False dichotomy. Those aren’t the only choices.

In your entire comment, you failed to realize that “Doomsider” is a perfectly viable option.

With “Doomsider” being an option for you, “officer” should be considered a distant second.

When you actually want to respond to what I said I will be waiting.

Certainly. Thank you for your patience, and for the opportunity for discussion.

I respectfully and summarily reject the underlying premise of what you were saying. Your comment did not consider that you are the person best capable of providing your own “protection”.

I submit that the regulatory environment needs to recognize and respect that fact.

What are you waiting for? I have responded twice before this comment. Your comment is premised on a false dichotomy. When we eliminate that premise, the remainder of your comment doesn’t make much sense.

One route forward: You could support your position on a different premise. Another route: You could abandon your previous position and adopt a new one. I eagerly await your choice.

You must be white passing and at least middle class to trust bringing the police into any situation.

Like anyone who grew up poor you know not to trust anyone including officers. I have called 911 on guys beating their girlfriends. I have had an officer pull their gun on me for no reason. I have lived in big cities, small, and rural so I know a thing or two.

I agree. I would much rather rely on myself for protection. Forget trusting the cops, I don’t trust the prosecutors. There are so many liberal prosecutors who are just drop cases, and judges who set low bail, or refuse to impose certain sentence types on repeat offenders, etc. People who want to take away guns are retards.

How would guns have helped in the George Floyd case?

More protesters would have been shot. The movement would have been demonized even more than it was.

The protests were already overwhelming peaceful. To re-envision history saying “moars guns” would have helped is pretty bizarre gun nutters nonsense.

Is this a serious question?

Do you believe armed protesters are easier or more difficult to suppress?

I don’t think that question is as simple as you think. Peaceful protest is much more likely to garner public support, at least until things are critical. And taking weapons to a protest in the US seems like an almost guaranteed way to die, one way or another. Not saying the cops are well trained with weapons, but neither are the general public.

there is a point where peaceful protest is not enough, you realize that, right?

The BLM protestors who marched with guns in Georgia didn’t get fucked with by the cops at all, because the cops were scared. Look it up.

Other BLM protestors got beat down by cops in riot gear, in countless examples across the country (when the protestors were unarmed).

Some people think that situations where they can rely on others’ strength are normal.

Thus they may agree with need for weapons and self-defense, because “it’s a dangerous time”, but not when everything is in order again. Not even thinking that said “dangerous time” somehow happened and will happen again.

Guns are similar to fire extinguishers and defibrillators in that most of time they are not needed.

Guns are meant to extinguish lives. The others are meant to save them.

Yes, they are. It’s like demolishing dangerous construction. Guns to extinguish lives on firm trajectory to extinguishing yours are part of just guns to extinguish lives. When you solve this human problem with some technology or philosophy smart thing, let me know.

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