Taboo(lemmy.dbzer0.com)

Napoleon was from a time when monarchies were still the mainstream. Hitler is post 1848 revolutions and series of reforms that gradually changed perceptions and general education of the populace.

Though Napoleon’s wars caused a large amount of destruction and received appropriate criticism, it was still considered pretty much the norm at that time of imperial dominance.

Hitler on the other hand acted when democracy and civil rights were heading towards full growth. The people’s thoughts and general knowledge were very different from Napoleon’s era.

As a side note, France before and during Napoleon lost most of its foreign colonies. So his wars in large majority had European victims. Yet that wasn’t enough to make him taboo, which means having European victims isn’t the main issue that caused Hitler to be taboo.

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db0@lemmy.dbzer0.comOPM

-1 points

1 month ago

Nonsense. Hitler is taboo in EU and US because of the atrocities he committed towards Europeans. Not because they “conquered democratic Europeans”. Americans have done and are doing the same and more towards latin america, asia and middle east without anything close to that condemnation. It’s not about the conquest, it’s about westerners being OK with imperialist atrocity as long as it’s done against the “other”.

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lath@lemmy.world

6 points

1 month ago

That’s bullshit and you should know it. No powerful nation reached its status without oppressing and exploiting the weak, no matter the direction of the compass you’re watching. And the more ambitious, the greater the horrors committed.

You think the US isn’t being condemned? Have you been on the internet? It’s been and being condemned every day from the start. They just don’t give a fuck because they’re the foremost global military power.

Please. Out of sight, out of mind is a general human condition. Don’t excuse all others by making it an exclusive trait of a certain group you happen to dislike.

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db0@lemmy.dbzer0.comOPM

-4 points

1 month ago

Not exactly. Hitler is taboo in EU because he did to the Europeans what they were doing to the rest of the world until then. But he’s certainly not taboo in a lot of the colonies, which see him as the unlikely anti-hero which pretty much destroyed the colonial powers which were oppressing them until then.

And no, the US is not nearly as condemned as Nazi Germany, except by radical leftists which are the ones making memes like these.

The point of this meme is to point out the European hypocrisy, and I don’t get your urgent need to discount that.

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Dojan@lemmy.world

3 points

1 month ago

This is true. I’ve met plenty of people that haven’t ever even heard of Hitler. He’s not as big of a deal outside of the Euro/Western sphere as he is within it.

There are plenty of people who are viewed differently depending on the cultural context. Mother Theresa for example is painted as a saint here in the west, but is considered quite monstruous in the areas she “helped.”

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belastend@slrpnk.net

3 points

1 month ago

Iranians greeted the german national team with the hitler salute. In 2004. Not because he “destroyed the colonial powers that oppressed them”. But because he killed people who werent Iranian. And half of them were Jewish.

You know, the people werent considered to be European in the 40s and who still arent considered European by the right.

Every continent, every region ignores the atrocities of those who did not kill them, lol.

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lath@lemmy.world

5 points

1 month ago

Here’s the thing, Europe has about 40-50 countries depending on where you look and who you ask. Of those, only 13 had at least a colony, with UK being top dog in this and Germany being in the middle of the pack.

So let’s say that a third of the states in Europe might have at any point in history been able to abuse their colonial powers. Some of those that did are repentant nowadays, others not so much.

The problem with this is you say Europe, but it’s actually 1/3 of it. By doing this, you confirm my “out of sight, out of mind” remark as obviously few people would seem to care about the rest 2/3 of Europe having little to no say in the matter because you know, they’ve been rolled over and over across the centuries by the higher military powers at the times simply not giving a fuck.

The US waged a cultural propaganda war, won and is now in a superior position allowing it to somewhat maintain the illusion. Only time might allow that general perception to change.

As for European hypocrisy, it’s just general hypocrisy where politicians smile at the public and exchange benefits. The backstabbing exists as much as everywhere else and the unity exists out of need. Without the different types of pressure from Russia, China, US and such, there would be no EU because there’s too much bad history in between.

I’m going off rails… Anyway, my “urgent need” isn’t really urgent, I just caught the post in an empty period of time i have nothing better to fill with. And the meme is warping a state of things we can only comment on long after the facts in order to generate spite.

You say Europeans. I ask which ones.

You say all of them. I say we’re not that united. It’s more of a love-hate polyamory.

You instead say the ones the matter. I say if only some matter, then why hate on the rest as well?

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