Comment by porous_grey_matter@lemmy.ml on Hard to swallow pills

Idk, they probably have had the opportunity sometimes, but they don’t have the same military industrial complex as the USA pushing for it at every chance. So the cost benefit analysis is different. Quite often it doesn’t benefit “the USA” as much as a few specific people within, and that mechanic doesn’t exist in the same way for China.

What do you mean that mechanic doesn’t exist in the same way for China? Are you talking like China has achieved a classless utopia situation?

No, the arms manufacturers just don’t have the same level of influence over the government and armed forces that they do in America, and the people in the government who decide whether to drop bombs won’t personally get rich if they buy more bombs.

That isn’t something unique to China btw but basically almost every country except USA and a few others.

Do you think that dynamic wouldn’t exist for any country, including China, that had as much world influence as the US does now?

I mean- yeah, the birdcage model has been supplanted by majority public ownership at this point, the same incentives that create the military industrial complex don’t exist- if you’d like, i would recommend reading “Economy and Class Structure of German Fascism” which can be a handy reference point for the US military complex.

Saying that China doesn’t have a MIC is a non-sequitur. The incentive is power. If acquiring or maintaining power in China requires military expansion, it will happen.

Except imperialism is actually incredibly inefficient in the long term. Western nations become imperialist due to the contradictions created by capitalism.There is a reason why China’s foreign policy is centered around mutual advancement.

If you want power over another country, attacking them is a very inefficient path. You will take losses, and you won’t be able to take their resources intact. The easier and cheaper method is to just bribe their leaders into selling you whatever you want.

The US starts wars even when it doesn’t need to, because there are a handful of companies that stand to make a lot of money selling weapons. No other country has such a large and influential military lobby, so other countries tend not to start wars for private profit.

Can you be more clear in your question?

My point is that the real hard-to-swallow pill for people like OP is that China is not a magical place where everyone just sings kumbaya all day. China is just like any other country comprised of humans that has existed ever, and would do the same things the US is doing now if they could. The only reason this meme is in any way accurate is that China can’t realistically drop bombs like that, otherwise they would. Tankies like OP will defend imperialism all day long, as long as the imperialists say “Death To America!”. If the US poofed out of existence today, there would be a power vacuum quickly filled by exactly the same sort of people that are dropping those bombs in the meme.

So I guess my question is “What’s the point of pretending that China is any different?”

Your kind of reasoning is called “projection”. You are actually choking on that pill.

That’s just a thing you made up to justify not feeling bad, there is no reason to believe that anyone else would act the same way.

China is just like any other country comprised of humans that has existed ever, and would do the same things the US is doing now if they could.

Yeah, except they’re different countries, made up of different people, with a different culture, with a pretty much fundamentally different kind of organizational structure governing them. I don’t think “well, they’d probably do it too, if the US were gone” is a super convincing argument in favor of the US dropping bombs on people.

Rules:

Be civil and nice.
Try not to excessively repost, as a rule of thumb, wait at least 2 months to do it if you have to.

Hard to swallow pills(lemmy.ml)

Memes

!memes@lemmy.ml

Rules:

Community stats

Community moderators