Comment by Maggoty@lemmy.world on Back on Standard Time

Permanent daylight time gives us all of the downsides and exactly one benefit. I’m sorry you live that far North/South but that’s just how the seasons and tilt of the earth work. We shouldn’t be doing split time at all and we shouldn’t endeavor to be an hour off the rest of the world just so commuters can drive home with the sun in their eyes.

It’s not just north or south

You’re using a tilted and flattened map. Look at the US on Google Earth. It’s not level with latitude lines, and the northern states are expanded on any flat representation.

This is most noticeable at the equator, where there is no large variation. (There’s about 8 minutes difference due to secondary things, not axial tilt.)

… do you believe the person made the image for this comment? What evidence is shown in the image for you to believe that the tilt and shape of the earth wasn’t taken into consideration for the graphic, besides it being shown as a 2d image?

Because the reasons for the varying lengths of day are well known It’s more an exercise in figuring out why the map has such slanting in it.

You’re just like almost there, that graph isn’t about lengths of days. It’s an arbitrary representation of what someone would consider a “normal” time for the sun to set and rise. The gradient in colors is because of the shape of the earth, the blocky lines are probably the cut off counties/states that follow different timezones (would need to verify source for that though). I’ve gotta split but hopefully someone can explain it better in the mean time if you have more questions.

Thank you. You did a great job explaining it.

The gradients change based on time zones. You’ll see how they line up.

Walking over a time zone line changes time one hour, but the sunset time doesn’t magically change an hour.

Like say you are standing between Georgia and Alabama. If you walk into Georgia the sun will set at around 5:30pm EST. If you walk into Alabama the sun will set at around 4:30pm CST.

The sun is setting one hour earlier in Alabama but you are basically watching the exact same sunset.

As you go further west into Alabama the time zone change “makes more sense” because the time zone being exactly between Alabama and Georgia doesn’t make sense other than them being separate states.

Sioux Falls SD is 43.5460°N

Rapid City SD is 44.0805°N

Sioux Falls Sunset is at 5:13pm CST

Rapid City Sunset is at 4:38pm MST

If both cities were in CST, Rapid City sun would set at 5:38pm CST

Due to the latitude difference, the sunsets should be 25 minutes apart

However, they are 35 minutes apart due to the time zone difference

If you said “Sioux Falls is farther south than Rapid City” and tried to base sunset time on just that, you’d be wrong.

And? We’re not abolishing timezones any time soon. So there’s always going to be that issue of the easternmost and westernmost towns in a time zone. That’s not a reason for anything.

Like I said, “It’s not just north or south.”

Time zones change the sunset time east and west as well.

Abolishing time zones has nothing to do with “fixing” daylight savings.

Even if we all switched to UTC and got rid of time zones . Everyone would have to decide when to go to bed, when to wake up, and when to work to fit it around the sun.

5:13pm CST is 11:13pm UTC

If Sioux Falls wanted to stay “standard time” for the sun. They would have to start work at 3pm UTC and get off work at 11pm UTC. (9am to 5pm)

Yet they could decide that they wanted to get “daylight savings time” for the sun, they would start work at 2pm UTC and get off at 10pm UTC. They would get one extra hour of sun after work instead of before.

Okay we’re not talking about the same thing here.

The length of your day is not defined by your time zone. It is defined by your latitude, how far north of the equator you are. X degrees north gets Y hours of sunlight at N time of year.

It’s that simple. So instead of creating a fucking nightmare for commerce and programming, we should be working the hours that make sense. Being on the western edge of a time zone means your work hours should be different than on the Eastern edge.

If you shift the zone, you’re not going to get more sunlight, you’re going to get a later time to go home from your boss. The problem isn’t the time zone. It’s capitalism demanding you work the entire day away even though productivity has increased massively and we work far more than our ancestors from supposedly dreary times.

That’s why shifting the time zone is, at most, going to get you the sun in your eyes as you drive home. It’s not going to give you any more hours of sunlight. Those don’t magically appear. And it wastes energy as people try to heat the coldest part of the day instead of staying under their blankets. Savings Time literally is the worst option except in the one regard of trying to preserve afternoon light for people rich enough to enjoy it.

There is no formal requirement for your state to stay within its current timezone.

If we go to permanent DST, you can petition for your state to switch to the next timezone to the west, which would give you the same time as permanent standard time in your current timezone. Detroit, for example, is on the western edge of ET. Sunrise in winter for them would be as late as 9AM, which is ridiculous. But, if Michigan shifts to CT instead of ET, sunrise goes to 8AM, and everyone is happy.

Move yourself from EDT to CDT, which is the same as EST. Or move from CDT to MDT/CST. Or MDT to PDT/MST. Or PDT to AKDT/PST.

If you don’t want to drive home with your the sun in your eyes, take a job to the east of your home.

Or we could just stop trying to fuck with it and leave it on standard time. Timezones are an international standard. You could easily just adjust your business hours. Instead we’re out here bending everything, even literal time around the capitalist demand for productivity. Just stop fucking with it.

Timezones are an international standard.

UTC offsets are an international standard. The specific UTC offset to adopt in any particular geographic area is by no means an international standard. That decision is made at a relatively low level of government.

Or we could just stop trying to fuck with it and leave it on standard time.

Clearly, you and I don’t want to be in the same time zone. Let’s dump the “Standard Time” and “DST” names. They are really just confusing the issue.

Eastern Standard Time is currently UTC-5. What state are you in, and what UTC offset do you want to permanently use?

I am in easterm Ohio, and I want to be permanently on UTC-4.

I think Maine and much of New England would choose to be on permanent UTC-3, so sunset is never before 4PM.

I think Michigan would probably choose permanent UTC-5, so sunrise is never after 8AM.

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