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175 points

Some data formats are easy for humans to read but difficult for computers to efficiently parse. Others, like packed binary data, are dead simple for computers to parse but borderline impossible for a human to read.

XML bucks this trend and bravely proves that data formats do not have to be one or the other by somehow managing to be bad at both.

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9 points

Just a while ago, I read somewhere: XML is like violence. If it doesn’t solve your problem, maybe you are not using it enough.

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3 points

There are people who find XML hard to read?

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3 points

I see you’ve never worked with SOAP services that have half a dozen or more namespaces.

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5 points

Over time I have matured as a programmer and realize xml is very good to use sometimes, even superior. But I still want layers between me and it. I do output as yaml when I have to see what’s in there

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3 points
*

Depends on how complex it is. Ever see the XML behind SharePoint? 🤮

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3 points

But is that the fault of XML, or is the data itself just complex, or did they structure the data badly?

Would another human readable format make the data easier to read?

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25 points

Strong competition from yaml and json on this point however

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42 points

JSON not supporting comments is a human rights violation

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9 points

I wrote a powershell script to parse some json config to drive it’s automation. I was delighted to discover the built-in powershell ConvertFrom-Json command accepts json with // comments as .jsonc files. So my config files get to be commented.

I hope the programmer(s) who thought to include that find cash laying in the streets everyday and that they never lose socks in the dryer.

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5 points

Wouldn’t go that far, but it’s an annoyance for sure.

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15 points

IIRC, the original reason was to avoid people making custom parsing directives using comments. Then people did shit like "foo": "[!-- number=5 --]" instead.

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32 points

Alright, the YAML spec is a dang mess, that I’ll grant you, but it seems pretty easy for my human eyes to read and write. As for JSON – seriously? That’s probably the easiest to parse human-readable structured data format there is!

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8 points

My biggest gripe is that human eyes cannot in fact see invisible coding characters such as tabs and spaces. I cannot abide by python for the same reason.

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1 point

Those formats are not for humans to read or write. Those are for parsers to interpret.

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9 points

it is anything but easy to read if your entire file does not fit on a single screen.

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3 points

We’re we are going we don’t need any comments.

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2 points

I don’t know much apart from the basics of YAML, what makes it complicated for computers to parse?

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51 points

The thing is, it was never really intended as a storage format for plain data. It’s a markup language, so you’re supposed to use it for describing complex documents, like it’s used in HTML for example. It was just readily available as a library in many programming languages when not much else was, so it got abused for data storage a lot.

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8 points

That’s why professionals use XML or JSON for this kind of projects and SQL for that kind of projects. And sometimes even both. It simply depends on the kind of problem to solve.

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