You are viewing a single thread.
View all comments View context
1 point

Even though the US is flawed, having 2 parties is massively more democratic than having 1. Because with 2, you at least have the “party in power” and “the opposition”.

I would rather the Republican party never be in power, or in the opposition. Their existence provides no benefit to the country whatsoever. They are corrupt, bigoted, actively anti-democratic, and militaristic. They are responsible (along with many, many democrats, I might add) for pointless wars of aggression that killed roughly a million people, and are currently supporting and supplying an ongoing genocide that’s killing people at an even faster rate. They are, in every way, a detriment to the country and an impediment to democracy.

Anyone with a lick of sense and the means to do so would seek to lock them out from accessing the levers of power the moment they have the means to do so. If, in Spain, a Francoist party emerged and started gaining a bunch of corporate funding and getting closer and closer to taking over and reestablishing a dictatorship, would it be so wrong to ban such a party to prevent them from coming to power? Would the addition of such a party to Spain’s political environment make the country more democratic?

As you say, after the Nationalists won the civil war, they remained in power for over 30 years, and the people lost the ability to change things through the political process, they just had to wait for the dictator to die. Those are the stakes. The enemy is more than happy to use whatever means necessary to seize power for themselves and shut everyone else out of the process in order to enact their reactionary, bigoted agenda. Such a political force should be stamped out by whatever means necessary. If they aren’t, then eventually you will be forced to choose between sitting idly by as more and more innocent people are fed into the meat grinder, or sending a dictator’s car over a building.

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

The francoist party is not ilegal in Spain. It still exists to this day, just no one votes for them. Banning them would make Spain less democratic.

The way to avoid your scenario is not to ban parties, which is hurtful for democracy (who decides what party to ban? What happens when it is your party the one that is banned?). The way to avoid it is to have laws to regulate the processes you mentioned. For example limiting political donations. Maximum campaign budgets, subsidies to small political parties that reach X% of votes, and so on.

What protects us from an undemocratic party being elected and abolishing democracy is the constitution, which requires a supermajority to change. A brexit-like vote where 51% get to massively decide the course of the country can’t happen.

And if 75% or whatever (I don’t know the exact %) of the people want to remove democracy, so be it, they might’ve figured out a better system. That’s why constitutions are non immutable.

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point
*

The way to avoid it is to have laws to regulate the processes you mentioned.

The US does not have such laws, and both major parties benefit from not having them as not having them ensures their positions without having to give the people anything. It is a system where the foxes are loose in the henhouse, the rich have near total control over the political process and can do whatever they want and there exists little to no hope of ever changing that.

In China, they have managed to avoid such an outcome. They’ve done so by entrenching the power of the communist party. Now, it may be that the ideal system is one with the regulations in place to allow a wider range of ideas to compete on a level playing field, but if we’re just comparing those two, in the one case, capitalists have full control over the political system, and in the other, communists do. American capitalists have the same kind of ability to prevent things they don’t like from happening as Chinese communists do. The only real difference I see between them is that the communists at least occasionally do things that actually help people, like eliminating poverty or taking measures to prevent the spread of COVID or investing in green energy, while the capitalists are only ever concerned with squeezing us as hard as they can and letting us die for the sake of their profits.

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

I don’t know why you’re so fixated on comparing america and china when this post is specifically about china and I already agree that america is not the pinnacle of democracy.

But if you want to compare them, they’re not even in the same league. If you look at the democracy index, America is 7.85 (#29) while China is 2.12 (#48).

American capitalists don’t have anywhere near the power of china’s CCP. Doesn’t matter how you slice it.

And don’t pretend that the CCP are angels. As this post mentions, there is an ongoing genocide happening in china. They are constantly threatening an invasion on Taiwan. They brutally repress protests, and it’s not like only tianmen square happened, look at Hong Kong, which was very recent. Their workers are so enslaved that they have a domestic demand issue, since their own workers can’t afford to consume what they produce.

Let’s not pretend china is communist either. If the workers working for pennies is not enough proof, there are 400 billionaires living in china. How does one become a billionaire in a communist state? (Spoiler: China has powerful capitalists too).

permalink
report
parent
reply

Political Memes

!politicalmemes@lemmy.world

Create post

Welcome to politcal memes!

These are our rules:

Be civil

Jokes are okay, but don’t intentionally harass or disturb any member of our community. Sexism, racism and bigotry are not allowed. Good faith argumentation only. No posts discouraging people to vote or shaming people for voting.

No misinformation

Don’t post any intentional misinformation. When asked by mods, provide sources for any claims you make.

Posts should be memes

Random pictures do not qualify as memes. Relevance to politics is required.

No bots, spam or self-promotion

Follow instance rules, ask for your bot to be allowed on this community.

Community stats

  • 11K

    Monthly active users

  • 1.5K

    Posts

  • 39K

    Comments